| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3] > | Do translation agencies have the right to scan translators' computers? Thread poster: Vickie Dimitriadou (X)
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John Fossey 
Canada
Local time: 17:13
Member (2008)
French to English
+ ...
...cross it out.
Probably written by lawyers who know nothing about the profession.
| | | | Paul Lambert
Sweden
Local time: 23:13
Member (2006)
Swedish to English
+ ...
| What a bunch of baloney! | Dec 26, 2014 |
I would not agree to that. As a freelancer or independent contractor, you are responsible to the client for what you deliver. You are not responsible to provide an exposition of your entire working process.
Imagine such a clause in any other form of business. If you go to a restaurant, you personally do not demand to inspect the entire kitchen and have a review of the nutritional value of all the food etc.
Or when you fly on an aeroplane, you are not entitled to go and ... See more I would not agree to that. As a freelancer or independent contractor, you are responsible to the client for what you deliver. You are not responsible to provide an exposition of your entire working process.
Imagine such a clause in any other form of business. If you go to a restaurant, you personally do not demand to inspect the entire kitchen and have a review of the nutritional value of all the food etc.
Or when you fly on an aeroplane, you are not entitled to go and personally inspect the mechanics of the aeroplane just before take off.
I am sure we could come up with hundreds of analogies.
Ridiculous demand as far as I am concerned. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 23:13
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
| I'm familiar with the second one | Dec 26, 2014 |
sodade wrote:
* We reserve the right to scan your computer...
* We reserve the right to carry out an onsite check...
I have seen the "onsite check" clause a few times, and have only signed it once, when I was certain that it would never happen. All the usual objections apply, e.g. that such a check would compromise the confidentiality of other clients, etc. The clause may be fair to translators who have a place of business separate from their homes, but how many freelance translators work like that?
I have never seen the "scan your computer" clause, and I would not agree to it either, because the only way the client can scan the computer is using a proprietary scanning program that I would have to install on my computer, and I wouldn't feel comfortable about that. If a client wants to know whether I have an anti-virus program that is kept up to date, I'll be happy to send screenshots of it, though.
| | | | Lincoln Hui
Hong Kong
Local time: 05:13
Member
Chinese to English
+ ...
| Behavior detection | Dec 26, 2014 |
Samuel Murray wrote:
I have never seen the "scan your computer" clause, and I would not agree to it either, because the only way the client can scan the computer is using a proprietary scanning program that I would have to install on my computer, and I wouldn't feel comfortable about that.
Which, by the way, would likely be killed by many commercial anti-virus programs.
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Sheila Wilson
Spain
Local time: 22:13
Member (2007)
English
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| Wrong people entirely! | Dec 26, 2014 |
Paul Lambert wrote:
Imagine such a clause in any other form of business. If you go to a restaurant, you personally do not demand to inspect the entire kitchen and have a review of the nutritional value of all the food etc.
Or when you fly on an aeroplane, you are not entitled to go and personally inspect the mechanics of the aeroplane just before take off.
OTOH, there are controlling authorities who do just that - health inspectors and flight safety inspectors carry out checks in those areas, and nobody complains (apart from those who contravene safety ). And if we're working in very security-sensitive sectors (which most of us aren't, most of the time) then we must expect to be checked, too. BUT, it would be the competent authority (e.g. a government, military or police body) who should order and oversee the checks. NOT a translation agency, for goodness' sake!
Let's not forget that agencies are not just our clients. They are also, and in a very real way, our competitors. And they have a lot to gain from access to the information we hold.
| | | | | Copy and paste | Dec 26, 2014 |
The most likely scenario here is that the agency itself was required to sign these clauses with THEIR client (could be a government body) and they simply trying to pass it down the foodchain, either due to ignorance or because their client required them to have all their subcontractors sign it.
As others have said before, if it doesn't make sense, do not sign!
Katalin
| | | | Adam Łobatiuk
Poland
Local time: 23:13
Member (2009)
English to Polish
+ ...
| Been there before | Dec 26, 2014 |
Another large company which used to be my main client introduced its own online CAT tool and a new NDA with very similar clauses. Back then, I had little choice and accepted it. Fortunately, after some time the NDA expired and I never renewed it, because I had already found better clients. One of those clients was the one who this thread is about and they are also introducing their online CAT tool now.
It seems that some large companies choose security as their unique selling point,... See more Another large company which used to be my main client introduced its own online CAT tool and a new NDA with very similar clauses. Back then, I had little choice and accepted it. Fortunately, after some time the NDA expired and I never renewed it, because I had already found better clients. One of those clients was the one who this thread is about and they are also introducing their online CAT tool now.
It seems that some large companies choose security as their unique selling point, and with this go poor rates, because only desperate translators would risk the privacy of their own homes and the confidentiality of their work for other clients. Even though this company doesn't have an office in my country, they could probably hire a local vendor to conduct onsite checks if they wanted to.
The security measures are ineffective anyway — if a translator were to disclose their clients' confidential information, they could simply make screenshots, invite their competitors to their place or just give them their login data.
I'm not signing the new NDA, and so I hope are most other colleagues. Some time ago, the same company tried to lower our rates, we made ourselves heard on forums like this one, and they backed down. I hope we win again, and if not let them play with bottom feeders. ▲ Collapse
| | | | Paul Lambert
Sweden
Local time: 23:13
Member (2006)
Swedish to English
+ ...
| Bad analogies | Dec 27, 2014 |
Sheila Wilson wrote: OTOH, there are controlling authorities who do just that - health inspectors and flight safety inspectors carry out checks in those areas, and nobody complains (apart from those who contravene safety ). And if we're working in very security-sensitive sectors (which most of us aren't, most of the time) then we must expect to be checked, too. BUT, it would be the competent authority (e.g. a government, military or police body) who should order and oversee the checks. NOT a translation agency, for goodness' sake! Let's not forget that agencies are not just our clients. They are also, and in a very real way, our competitors. And they have a lot to gain from access to the information we hold.
True. Not the best analogies on my part. Still, I think we are on the same page on this issue.
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| Where does it end? | Dec 27, 2014 |
Give your house keys to a stranger and be surprised that your house is empty when you come home. Sounds to me like a bad April Fools Day joke, only it is December.
We are independent entrepeneurs, and it is nobody's business how I secure my computer. The thought only, ofcourse we all have a anti virus programm. What do they think, we leave the doors wide open?
I would never agree, even if I accidently had signed for it.
| | | | nrichy (X)
France
Local time: 23:13
French to Dutch
+ ...
| I also am familiar with the second one | Dec 27, 2014 |
The "onsite check". But not this one. Weird. The strangest thing here is that those companies ask you at the same time to sign a confidentiality agreement... must be schizophrenic.
By the way, do they know that by this measure they loose translators, exactly those who care about confidentiality?
| | | | Jeff Whittaker
United States
Local time: 17:13
Member (2002)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| It's a test... | Dec 28, 2014 |
If you are gullible and desperate enough to sign this contract, you will probably be more willing to also accept constant rush work, bottom-of-the-barrel rates, numerous requests for revisions and +30-day payment terms.
[Edited at 2014-12-28 16:40 GMT]
| | | | | would like to hear more about story | Dec 28, 2014 |
Triston Goodwin wrote:
I was once visited by a group of gentlemen in an unmarked white van that came to inspect my office while I was working on some government documents. I knew they were coming, and everything was already in order. It still wasn't a fun experience and I never accepted any more work from them.
Triston, this is extremely disturbing to hear and should not be ignored. Many people here and in other fora muse the clause about "onsite inspections" is just a bluff or a case of a misplaced employment clause inserted by ignorant lawyers. But if it actually happened to you, then it is neither of these, but, rather, a very real possibility. Yikes!!
In this light, it would be extremely enlightening for us to hear more about the onsite inspection to which you were subjected, at least as far as your NDA allows you to speak about it. For instance, did your contract include language about onsite visits? How were you informed people were coming? Were they government officials or agency staff? What did they look at? Did they talk with you or was it a silent inspection? Again, these questions are certainly not asking you to breach any confidentiality or security measures or, for that matter, any measures that might make you a target of more surveillance, but any light you feel comfortable disclosing would be most helpful to this discussion.
It would also be important to know more, since someone in another forum said that the U.S. Dept. of Homeland Security is one the clients of the translation agency (a U.K. company) that wrote the clauses that started this thread.
Thanks, Triston, for any further light you can shed on this alarming situation!
[Edited at 2014-12-28 16:58 GMT]
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| Not as exciting as you would think... | Dec 28, 2014 |
Catherine V. Howard wrote: Triston Goodwin wrote:
I was once visited by a group of gentlemen in an unmarked white van that came to inspect my office while I was working on some government documents. I knew they were coming, and everything was already in order. It still wasn't a fun experience and I never accepted any more work from them. Triston, this is extremely disturbing to hear and should not be ignored. Many people here and in other fora muse the clause about "onsite inspections" is just a bluff or a case of a misplaced employment clause inserted by ignorant lawyers. But if it actually happened to you, then it is neither of these, but, rather, a very real possibility. Yikes!! In this light, it would be extremely enlightening for us to hear more about the onsite inspection to which you were subjected, at least as far as your NDA allows you to speak about it. For instance, did your contract include language about onsite visits? How were you informed people were coming? Were they government officials or agency staff? What did they look at? Did they talk with you or was it a silent inspection? Again, these questions are certainly not asking you to breach any confidentiality or security measures or, for that matter, any measures that might make you a target of more surveillance, but any light you feel comfortable disclosing would be most helpful to this discussion. It would also be important to know more, since someone in another forum said that the U.S. Dept. of Homeland Security is one the clients of the translation agency (a U.K. company) that wrote the clauses that started this thread. Thanks, Triston, for any further light you can shed on this alarming situation! [Edited at 2014-12-28 16:58 GMT]
My experience wasn't too bad. I was actually working with a local agency that was in turn working directly with a government body that's rather fickle in regards to security and this was part of my security clearance. I also had to be fingerprinted and they preformed several background checks. Everything went smoothly, despite the perceived scariness of the situation.
They asked when they could come over. We had a nice chat, I showed them my office, they loved my skull, and we talked about internet security and so on.
I only performed a few translations for them and decided not to continue as I wasn't very interested in the subject matter, as you would expect something exciting after all that paperwork. The pay wasn't great either.
I actually had very little interaction with the agency representing the government, they just checked in on everything every now and then.
I was later offered an in-house job, but I live about 20 hours away from the facility and the commute would have been awful.
I personally wouldn't go through the process again. Especially knowing the agency that is requesting this information, but if they really are working with the DHS, CIS, FBI, or any other federal body, I would bet that the feds are the ones asking for authorization and the agency had to include it in their contact.
| | | | | good to know | Dec 28, 2014 |
Thanks for shedding more light on the experience, Triston. It's very telling.
Triston Goodwin wrote:
Especially knowing the agency that is requesting this information, but if they really are working with the DHS, CIS, FBI, or any other federal body, I would bet that the feds are the ones asking for authorization and the agency had to include it in their contact.
That makes a lot of sense, more than the idea that this agency wants to find out who else we're translating for (as if we were so central to their operations!) or what sites we visit (as if they cared). The only other explanation that seems almost as plausible is that it is a typical clause included in contracts with on-site employees, which the lawyers simply transferred wholesale to our B2B contracts. But your theory seems to mesh better with current realities.
So it sounds like you were visited by government agents doing background checks. As "unexciting" as the meeting was, that still doesn't mean it's not a revealing sign of the post-9/11 government surveillance that most US citizens have come to accept as "legitimate." I'm not surprised they would make it seem like a nice little chat, that's how they're trained. Don't forget they needed your consent to enter your private domicile, put you at ease, and record notes about their findings to add to your file with info from the background checks. They said they "loved" the skull you had in your house? This is *classic* interview technique to encourage someone to say more about something "notable," i.e., a potential security concern. You can bet that's in your file now.
I wonder if other people here have had similar visits as part of security clearance or as part of an agency contract....
[Edited at 2014-12-28 20:09 GMT]
| | | | Paul Lambert
Sweden
Local time: 23:13
Member (2006)
Swedish to English
+ ...
| Separate computers, perhaps? | Dec 28, 2014 |
The only way I can see that you could comply with such a request while respecting your non-disclosure agreements with other clients would be to have a completely separate computer dedicated to this one client. Or am I missing something?
[Edited at 2014-12-28 18:42 GMT]
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