| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | European Union Model Standard Contractual Clauses (Processors) Thread poster: Samuel Murray
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Samuel Murray 
Netherlands
Local time: 18:05
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
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Hello everyone
A US client of mine wants me to sign this agreement which was drawn up by the EU.
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/data-protection/international-transfers/transfer/index_en.htm
I have no clear idea what the contract is about (something to do with the import, export and processing of personal data, but whose... See more Hello everyone
A US client of mine wants me to sign this agreement which was drawn up by the EU.
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/data-protection/international-transfers/transfer/index_en.htm
I have no clear idea what the contract is about (something to do with the import, export and processing of personal data, but whose personal data, I don't know), or which of the parties mentioned in it is/are me. If I understand correctly, then it would require me to hire a full-time legal or admin person just to keep track of all the bits of data that the contract requires me to keep track of and to notify the various parties if and when various triggers happen.
Have any of you had to deal with this sort of thing? What did you do?
Samuel ▲ Collapse
| | | | Jean Lachaud
United States
Local time: 12:05
English to French
+ ...
| What personal data are involved?? | Mar 31, 2016 |
This not an agreement to be signed, but a list of procedural moves.
The beauty of being independent contractors lies in what Nancy Reagan became famous for: "Just Say No."
| | | | Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:05
Member (2009)
Dutch to English
+ ...
| Have they told you exactly which contract they want you to sign? | Mar 31, 2016 |
Samuel Murray wrote: Hello everyone A US client of mine wants me to sign this agreement which was drawn up by the EU. http://ec.europa.eu/justice/data-protection/international-transfers/transfer/index_en.htm I have no clear idea what the contract is about (something to do with the import, export and processing of personal data, but whose personal data, I don't know), or which of the parties mentioned in it is/are me. If I understand correctly, then it would require me to hire a full-time legal or admin person just to keep track of all the bits of data that the contract requires me to keep track of and to notify the various parties if and when various triggers happen. Have any of you had to deal with this sort of thing? What did you do? Samuel
The link you gave doesn't lead to a specific contract, but is a webpage about new EU stuff.
I suspect this has sth to do with being allowed to store client data in the US vs EU cloud, and the various (changing) rules that apply to that at the moment. Some EU clients insist that their data should never leave the EU, and specifically, that it should never be stored on US soil (as it could then be snooped on by spooks).
An example from practice:
If you use CrashPlan (purchased via the regular website) to backup your data, your data gets stored in the US. However, there is one UK CrashPlan reseller (http://ceejay.com/ ) that guarantees that all your data will stay in the EU (they have a sever in Amsterdam, if I remember correctly). You can use them if you need to keep your stuff in the EU. However, then there is of course the problem of your email provider, both yours and all of your clients'.
If you ask me, the whole thing is pretty pointless, and I'd just drop them if they insist you need to sign too many of these silly paranoid contracts.
Michael
[Edited at 2016-03-31 19:40 GMT]
PS: Just reread your original post, and saw that your client is in the US. Not sure how this might affect what I just said, but as I said, I'd need to see the actual contract itself first.
[Edited at 2016-03-31 19:42 GMT]
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 18:05
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
JL01 wrote:
This not an agreement to be signed, but a list of procedural moves.
Well, it requires a signature and it starts off with the words "[x] and [x] have agreed on the following..."
The beauty of being independent contractors lies in what Nancy Reagan became famous for: "Just Say No."
I'd rather say "yes" if the client is valuable.
Michael J.W. Beijer wrote:
The link you gave doesn't lead to a specific contract, but is a webpage about new EU stuff.
Yes, and my post title relates to "processors" and there is a link to the contract for processors on that page, but here, let me give you the direct link:
http://ec.europa.eu/justice/data-protection/international-transfers/files/clauses_for_personal_data_transfer_processors_c2010-593.doc
If you ask me, the whole thing is pretty pointless...
It's more confusing than pointless. The client is labelled by the EU as an "exporter" of personal data, and I'm an "importer" of personal data, and so various things apply to me as importer.
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Jean Lachaud
United States
Local time: 12:05
English to French
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| Proverbial 10-foot pole | Mar 31, 2016 |
Considering what is going on with respect to this issue, what has been reported, the significant differences between EU and USA, and having talked about it with a lawyer friend a few weeks ago, I wouldn't touch this client, or the contracts, with the proverbial 10-foot pole.
It's more confusing than pointless. The client is labelled by the EU as an "exporter" of personal data, and I'm an "importer" of personal data, and so various things apply to me as importer.
| | | | | It is confusing, indeed | Apr 2, 2016 |
Hi Samuel,
I received the same request presumable from the same agency.
They required signing four documents, two of them are these EU related stuff.
I have not had the time to read through them in detail, but I can already see there are some very weird things in the whole package.
I think this may be related to translatable materials that include personal data, such as medical files or legal proceedings. (I normally don't work on such materials.)
What is interestin... See more Hi Samuel,
I received the same request presumable from the same agency.
They required signing four documents, two of them are these EU related stuff.
I have not had the time to read through them in detail, but I can already see there are some very weird things in the whole package.
I think this may be related to translatable materials that include personal data, such as medical files or legal proceedings. (I normally don't work on such materials.)
What is interesting though is that they have offices all over the world, abut I am mostly in touch with their US branches. The truth is, even if a job is coming from one of their European clients, the job gets uploaded to their servers by their own employees. Their network is all over the world, servers everywhere I assume, so before I get the data, it is already on US soil. So in that sense they are themselves the exporter and the importer as well.
I asked them to tell me whom I could discuss these issues with, so far they just asked back what my questions were. I have yet to get back into the discussion. I haven't signed anything yet. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Samuel, you are in the EU, so it should not apply to you | Apr 2, 2016 |
This whole issue is about exporting data out of the EU, into countries that are considered "unsafe" in terms of protecting personal data.
Since you are based in the Netherlands, you should be considered safe, and you are not an "importer" of data, as you are also within the EU.
Have you asked them whether their database correctly includes your residence?
Katalin
| | | | | I dumped them. | Apr 2, 2016 |
An essentially identical request, or rather demand, showed up in the mail from one of my US clients a couple of months ago. I handled it the same way I handled an Italian outfit that pulled an analogous stunt: I dumped them without comment. I've got more work than I can handle from other agencies whose management just wants to do good, honest business. That leaves me precious little time or energy to waste on playing legal footsie with folks who obviously can't trust me any farther than than the... See more An essentially identical request, or rather demand, showed up in the mail from one of my US clients a couple of months ago. I handled it the same way I handled an Italian outfit that pulled an analogous stunt: I dumped them without comment. I've got more work than I can handle from other agencies whose management just wants to do good, honest business. That leaves me precious little time or energy to waste on playing legal footsie with folks who obviously can't trust me any farther than than they can throw me. ▲ Collapse
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Jean Lachaud
United States
Local time: 12:05
English to French
+ ...
| There you go! | Apr 2, 2016 |
Proper response. Well said.
Richard Bartholomew wrote:
An essentially identical request, or rather demand, showed up in the mail from one of my US clients a couple of months ago. I handled it the same way I handled an Italian outfit that pulled an analogous stunt: I dumped them without comment. I've got more work than I can handle from other agencies whose management just wants to do good, honest business. That leaves me precious little time or energy to waste on playing legal footsie with folks who obviously can't trust me any farther than than they can throw me.
| | | | Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:05
Serbian to English
+ ...
| Feels like you got it the wrong way round | Apr 2, 2016 |
Samuel Murray wrote:
It's more confusing than pointless. The client is labelled by the EU as an "exporter" of personal data, and I'm an "importer" of personal data, and so various things apply to me as importer.
Are you sure?
Feels like you got it the wrong way round.
All these rules are about controlling the flow of personal data from the EU to US and other "unsafe" countries, so from the viewpoint of EU the "importer" IS NOT YOU but your US agency - you are potentially the "exporter" of data from EU to US, and also, unless you keep translating birth certificates and divorce papers concerning EU citizens, you won't be exporting much personal data through your translations;
sounds like some corporate lawyers trying to justify its fees by imposing as much paranoid nonsense as possible, and to add insult to injury, getting it the wrong way round wrong in the process!
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 18:05
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | @Katalin and @Daryo | Apr 3, 2016 |
Katalin Horváth McClure wrote:
Have you asked them whether their database correctly includes your residence?
That is a good point, I'll look into that.
Daryo wrote: Samuel Murray wrote:
The client is labelled by the EU as an "exporter" of personal data, and I'm an "importer" of personal data, and so various things apply to me as importer. Are you sure? Feels like you got it the wrong way round.
I actually queried the client's legal department, and they insist that I'm the importer and they're the exporter. The logic mentioned in your post is pretty much mine as well, but the client's lawyers believe the exact opposite.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 18:05
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
JL01 wrote:
Considering what is going on with respect to this issue, what has been reported...
What has been reported?
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Jean Lachaud
United States
Local time: 12:05
English to French
+ ...
| Read the press | Apr 3, 2016 |
French press has delved extensively a few weeks ago (February, top off my head) about the personal data and privacy kerfuffle between the EU and the USA.
I would think the press in other European countries would also have covered the issue.
However, there was precious little about the issue in the US media, understandably so since it is not going to lift ratings anytime soon, unlike the non-stop non-news coverage of some presidential contenders.
Samuel Murray wrote:
What has been reported?
| | | | Samuel Murray
Netherlands
Local time: 18:05
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
Samuel Murray wrote: Katalin Horváth McClure wrote:
Have you asked them whether their database correctly includes your residence? That is a good point, I'll look into that.
It turned out that I was listed incorrectly as being a resident outside the EU, although that did not change the fact that they wanted me to sign the same documents.
Daryo wrote: Samuel Murray wrote:
The client is labelled by the EU as an "exporter" of personal data, and I'm an "importer" of personal data, and so various things apply to me as importer. Are you sure? Feels like you got it the wrong way round. I actually queried the client's legal department, and they insist that I'm the importer and they're the exporter.
It turned out to be something simple: they have EU offices, so in that sense they are indeed an exporter of data. The words "importer" and "exporter" do not have their usual cross-border meanings in these EU agreements, I think, rather they mean something close to "receiver" and "sender".
One of the frustrating things about the agreement is that it states that the definitions of certain terms are the same as in Directive 95/46/EC, but those terms are not defined in Directive 95/46/EC -- they are simply used in it, and it is assumed that the reader knows what those terms mean. So... lots of googling.
| | | | Daryo
United Kingdom
Local time: 17:05
Serbian to English
+ ...
| that's another story altogether | Apr 7, 2016 |
Samuel Murray wrote: Samuel Murray wrote: Katalin Horváth McClure wrote:
Have you asked them whether their database correctly includes your residence? That is a good point, I'll look into that. It turned out that I was listed incorrectly as being a resident outside the EU, although that did not change the fact that they wanted me to sign the same documents. Daryo wrote: Samuel Murray wrote:
The client is labelled by the EU as an "exporter" of personal data, and I'm an "importer" of personal data, and so various things apply to me as importer. Are you sure? Feels like you got it the wrong way round. I actually queried the client's legal department, and they insist that I'm the importer and they're the exporter. It turned out to be something simple: they have EU offices, so in that sense they are indeed an exporter of data. The words "importer" and "exporter" do not have their usual cross-border meanings in these EU agreements, I think, rather they mean something close to "receiver" and "sender". One of the frustrating things about the agreement is that it states that the definitions of certain terms are the same as in Directive 95/46/EC, but those terms are not defined in Directive 95/46/EC -- they are simply used in it, and it is assumed that the reader knows what those terms mean. So... lots of googling.
If they ask you to authorise the "export" of personal data of EU citizens contained in your translations, they are DEFINITELY banging at the wrong door!!! These data are not "yours" to decide whether to export them or not outside of EU - it's a decision to be taken by the persons concerned, or the institutions that created the ST!
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