Pages in topic:   < [1 2]
Legal actions if foreign agencies do not pay? Mission impossible?
Thread poster: Peter Berntsen (X)
nrichy (X)
nrichy (X)
France
Local time: 23:30
French to Dutch
+ ...
Well, I don't either Jul 17, 2014

Peter Berntsen wrote:

@The Misha: I am impressed, you managed to express your arrogance and your sense of your own superiority in a single sentence. *applause*


With no arrogance whatsoever. He (or she, I don't know) is right. I only have one client abroad. I know that I can rely on them. And for another I have been waiting for my holidays to take a plane and go sitting on their doormat. They paid me just before. After 22 months.


 
Martyn Greenan
Martyn Greenan  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 17:30
French to English
+ ...
Oh dear Jul 17, 2014

The Misha wrote:

Maybe you simply shouldn't jump at every stinky little job from the other end of the globe where for all the practical purposes you have no legal recourse whatsoever. I know I don't.

[Edited at 2014-07-15 04:34 GMT]


You seem like a helpful chap.


 
Phil Hand
Phil Hand  Identity Verified
China
Local time: 06:30
Chinese to English
Can you get all recovery costs paid back? Jul 17, 2014

Sheila Wilson wrote:

Anyway, costs are always awarded - you don't end up out of pocket. I did use the French SCC, byt the way - my client not only paid my invoices but also all the costs incurred by both of us (for the court itself, bailiffs, etc, etc), plus interest. Nowadays, he'd pay other things too. The only thing I didn't get was reimbursement of postage and photocopying expenses, and I didn't get paid for the time I spent on it.

Sheila, would you get reimbursed for any legal costs prior to the specific court action? For example, getting a letter sent by a lawyer as a final warning?

My impression is that for anything under 100 euros, it's never going to be worth chasing it. Within your own country, assuming you have a decent small claims court, a three-figure sum should be recoverable. Within the EU it should be the same.

Once you get outside of your own country, debts become very difficult to chase down. The investments of time, money and energy into the recovery process soon far exceed the potential pay-off. Make sure you trust your partners, and assume it's all going to go wrong some day.


 
Charlie Bavington
Charlie Bavington  Identity Verified
Local time: 22:30
French to English
And another one Jul 18, 2014

Peter Berntsen wrote:

The alternative would be to simply stop accepting smaller jobs, there is a good case for this, since I have done some calculations that show that the smaller the job, the smaller the profit per hour (on avergae).


I'm not sure I entirely agree with the tone Misha used but I do agree with the underlying point raised. If you know nothing about how debt collection procedures work in country or how you would go about recovering what you're owed (directly or indirectly), my advice would be don't work with clients from that country.

Or if you do, I'd be inclined to adopt the opposite approach - only do smaller jobs. If I were to get ripped off by someone in Bolivia, Belarus or Burkina Faso, I'd probably rather it was for €150 and not €1,500.

Of course, you may disagree. I'm quite cautious by nature.


 
Peter Leeflang
Peter Leeflang  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 18:30
Member (2014)
French to English
+ ...
Why not contact the agency's customer then? Jul 18, 2014

Why not contact the agency's customer then?

It is in their interest to help resolve the issue, since the copyright, so ownership of the work, does not transfer until full payment has been done.


 
Sheila Wilson
Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 22:30
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Don't risk too much; and fight for it whenever feasible Jul 18, 2014

Phil Hand wrote:
Sheila, would you get reimbursed for any legal costs prior to the specific court action? For example, getting a letter sent by a lawyer as a final warning?

No, the debt you present to the courts if the amount of the invoice(s), plus any statutory interest and/or penalties due. But then a final demand sent by you personally by registered post to the client's head office is the only final demand required by French law (though this IS required, and you should present the proof of delivery to the court as evidence). A lawyer's letter would be your choice, at your expense.

Your client (ex-client by this time) hands over to the bailiffs not only this amount but also full reimbursement of your expenses (in France there was a charge of around 38€ when submitting the papers, plus over 100€ in bailiffs fees) and many other court costs that I never saw. In my particular case, the costs were very high as the client very stupidly ignored the first injunction. As they were still advertising for freelancers there was no way I was going to let them off the hook so I paid a second advance fee to the bailiffs for them to go round with the police and with authority to seize their computers etc.. But I agree that there has to be a lower limit, not so much because of the actual costs (which will only be for postage and photocopying) but for the time element. I certainly spent a considerable time on it. But in my case the claim was for 400€.

NB: my usual warning to anyone thinking of going down this path. If the court finds that the client had already filed for bankruptcy then (a) you won't receive a penny/cent, and (b) you'll be liable for some costs yourself. So, check them out just before submitting the claim. If they call in the receivers after that date then you'll be at the very top of the queue as it's actually the court they'll owe the money to, and the court will owe it to you.

Make sure you trust your partners, and assume it's all going to go wrong some day.

Great advice! Who hasn't had a really good friend let them down? Why expect better of business partners. You can only trust them within the limits that you're prepared to risk. Excessive risk is just asking for trouble.


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 22:30
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Occasions Jul 18, 2014

Peter Berntsen wrote:

As a freelancer, you often get requests for smaller jobs from agencies around the world. You can of course check the Blue Board at Proz and similar sites, but sometimes you have to just trust people (my personal opinion, though sometimes I feel silly).

However, sometimes this trust is not rewarded. My questions is, what legal options do I, as a freelance translator, have when it comes to agencies in other countries that do not pay?

I would like to hear your tips (if any), also on how to avoid potential non-paying agencies!


There have been three or four occasions on which agencies and in one case a direct client with an ostensibly impeccable reputation - all based in Italy, which is where nearly all my work comes from - have made the mistake of thinking they could get away with not paying me. In the end they always have.

One of the most foolish mistakes is that they think since the amount owed is small, they can get away with it. They can't.

I can't tell you how to do it because there's no system. All I would say is that there's an attitude, on my part, that regards getting paid as "simply another thing that needs to be done". There's no emotion involved in it. I don't get angry, sad, or vindictively "try to get even". I just do whatever is necessary, on a case by case basis. So far, nobody has ever succeeded in not paying me.

Let me add that these non-payers are a tiny minority. 99.99999% of the time everyone is honest and professional.

[Edited at 2014-07-18 15:30 GMT]


 
Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member because it was not in line with site rule
Pages in topic:   < [1 2]


To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator:


You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request »

Legal actions if foreign agencies do not pay? Mission impossible?







Trados Business Manager Lite
Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio

Trados Business Manager Lite helps to simplify and speed up some of the daily tasks, such as invoicing and reporting, associated with running your freelance translation business.

More info »
CafeTran Espresso
You've never met a CAT tool this clever!

Translate faster & easier, using a sophisticated CAT tool built by a translator / developer. Accept jobs from clients who use Trados, MemoQ, Wordfast & major CAT tools. Download and start using CafeTran Espresso -- for free

Buy now! »