Creating layout from scratch using MS Word (Windows 10). Any good tutorials out there?
Thread poster: Alvaro Pavié
Alvaro Pavié
Alvaro Pavié
Chile
Local time: 08:34
English to Spanish
+ ...
Sep 12, 2019

Greetings,

My client recently sent me a 5-pages protected PDF. She doesn't have the password to allow edition, so I had to translate manually and now I want to recreate the layout. Problem is, I need the resulting document to be a Word file format, and just realized today that the only DTP software I can afford (Scribus) can only export to PDF.

So my question is: Does anyone happen to know any good video tutorials to improve my layout skills using Word? I'm not that ine
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Greetings,

My client recently sent me a 5-pages protected PDF. She doesn't have the password to allow edition, so I had to translate manually and now I want to recreate the layout. Problem is, I need the resulting document to be a Word file format, and just realized today that the only DTP software I can afford (Scribus) can only export to PDF.

So my question is: Does anyone happen to know any good video tutorials to improve my layout skills using Word? I'm not that inexperienced with the software, but recreating the layout on the PDF doesn't seem that simple as it has a number of characteristics not usually found on a simple text file.

Thanks!
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Samuel Murray
Samuel Murray  Identity Verified
Netherlands
Local time: 12:34
Member (2006)
English to Afrikaans
+ ...
Learning Word isn't quick Sep 13, 2019

Alvaro Pavié wrote:
Does anyone happen to know any good video tutorials to improve my layout skills using Word?


I'm sure there will be some, but I don't think learning how to do layout in Word is something you could learn in just a few hours. In addition, unless you practice all the skills all the time, you'll soon forget them. Also, many of the things you can do in Word require you to be able to combine knowledge of the different functions, so you'll only become an expert after practising for a lengthy period of time.

I see several affordable courses at e.g. Udemy.com, and some of them look comprehensive enough (7 hours, 10 hours, etc), but the fact that a course is 10 hours long doesn't mean that you can learn what you want to learn in just 10 hours. Have a look at the sample videos to see if its just a webinar or an actual useful course: go to the course page, scroll down to the video list, click "Expand all" and then look for preview videos. Curiously, two of the Word courses have a free preview video of the exact same topic, namely setting tab stops, here and here, but from those previews I get the impression that what these guys call "advanced" is really just "introductory comments about stuff that very few people use" and not truly advanced stuff like creating good layouts. For example, both these courses' "intermediary" videos on setting tab stops relate only to setting tab stops initially, and not about fixing misbehaving or troubleshooting broken tab stops, which is rather essential knowledge. I think these courses assume that once you've sat through the 17 hours of video, you'll go out and play with it yourself and learn all the odd things that you're actually hoping to learn.

I understand you have this client who wants you to translate a file that you basically have available only on paper or as screenshots, but such clients should get someone to create an editable version of the file before they send it to the translator. Or, if the translator wants to take on the task of recreating the entire document, then good, but only if the translator is already skilled at doing that. Either way, the document re-creation should be done by someone who has the necessary skill, and whether you or the client hires that person to create the document doesn't matter. If the client wants you to "take care of it", then you're going to have to find a typist who is skilled at creating documents in MS Word, get them to create it (hope that they understand that they should not format using multiple spaces or by inserting line breaks in the middle of sentences), and then translate that in your CAT tool.

What I do when I'm in the situation you are in, is to tell the client that I can deliver only an approximation of the layout, so that the client can then give the file to someone who is truly an expert at layouts but do not speak the language, to fix it.


Alvaro Pavié
Philip Lees
Stephanie Busch
Luisa Ramos, CT
 
Alvaro Pavié
Alvaro Pavié
Chile
Local time: 08:34
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
I understand. Sep 13, 2019

My client said it wasn't necessary to recreate the layout, that she could do it herself. Still, I wanted to seize the opportunity to learn more about Word and DTP software so future projects become less cumbersome (don't think I'll have enough money to outsource that part of my work for a long time), but if it's too much in too little time, then I'll just do what I can and leave it at that.

Anyway, thanks for your advice, it's greatly appreciated.


 
Christel Zipfel
Christel Zipfel  Identity Verified
Local time: 12:34
Member (2004)
Italian to German
+ ...
It's not up to you to care for other than translation Sep 13, 2019

Alvaro Pavié wrote:

(don't think I'll have enough money to outsource that part of my work for a long time),


unless you offered to do so (and are paid for it).


Alvaro Pavié
Philip Lees
Stephanie Busch
Luisa Ramos, CT
 
Alvaro Pavié
Alvaro Pavié
Chile
Local time: 08:34
English to Spanish
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
It can't be helped (for now). Sep 13, 2019

Christel Zipfel wrote:
unless you offered to do so (and are paid for it).


Unfortunately, the company my client works for will not pay more for doing these types of tasks (and it's my first official gig, so quitting would be unwise), but you can be sure I will charge extra when future projects arrive at my doorstep.


 
Tina Vonhof (X)
Tina Vonhof (X)
Canada
Local time: 05:34
Dutch to English
+ ...
Relevant? Sep 13, 2019

I don't know if this could work for the layout you are translating but I use tables a lot to approximate difficult layouts. Using tables has the advantage of keeping everything in place and you can manipulate the columns and rows as needed.

Kevin Fulton
 
Lars Jelking
Lars Jelking  Identity Verified
Israel
Local time: 13:34
English to Swedish
+ ...
Try help in Word Sep 16, 2019

Open any document or create a new. Klick on the Help in the header, Select Show training and select your topic from the windows on the right side. There are tons useful stuff there.

 
Multiverse Solutions s.r.o. (X)
Multiverse Solutions s.r.o. (X)
Local time: 12:34
Polish to English
+ ...
Trending among customers Jan 12, 2020

The direct reply to your question is: follow the Word manual. It has everything you need, although the knowledge is served from the programmer's view point (menu by menu), and not task-focused.

Your question includes a major heavy trend among customers which may significantly reduce your income.

We (translators) live by hours. You may spent three hours translating and earn 3 hourly units. Or you may click, move, point, reshape, resize, etc. for three hours - and a) not
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The direct reply to your question is: follow the Word manual. It has everything you need, although the knowledge is served from the programmer's view point (menu by menu), and not task-focused.

Your question includes a major heavy trend among customers which may significantly reduce your income.

We (translators) live by hours. You may spent three hours translating and earn 3 hourly units. Or you may click, move, point, reshape, resize, etc. for three hours - and a) not earn anything, b) lose 6 hourly units (3 hours of layout work + 3 hours not used for paying work), c) give away your knowledge and skills for free.

If the customer is promising, I would still put a reasonable price on my work in the invoice AND discount it to zero. The idea is that your customer has to know and appreciate your work. If you yourself do not value your time and knowledge, why your customers would choose you?

Now the view from the back office. The customer practically always has editable documents. They work on them, use them, edit them. For some strange reason, just for translation, these documents are being scanned or printed to PDF. Their explanations range from reasonable ('our supplier won't send them to us') to weird ('yes, we have this file somewhere, but after signing and stamping we forgot about it, can you use this scan instead?').

If complex documents are translated, like product sheets with tables, charts, photos, etc., the customer may want to have a duplicate in the target language. I get it, they will be able to compare versions in a second or two. However, reconstructing such a document may take two hours. And it will never be perfect, due to the differences between Word and DTP programs. So the question is whether the customer is ready to pay for their convenience and comfort?

When they produce things for commercial use, they always have loads of money ready to launch the product. They will readily pay the printers for typesetting, layout AND design work. But they won't pay you, the translator. Why?

Because the printers appear to be large, stuffed with money, and they produce something tangible. Translators may do things for free, because they do not invest in technology and their product is virtual. And virtual is perceived as non-existent.

Time and again, you will face this approach. It is up to you how you handle it. If you feel comfortable with working for free, I would recommend forgetting about translation as a business and transitioning to a non-profit.

Otherwise, one day you may found yourself begging your customers to accept payment for translation from you. In the meantime, you will be sponsoring your customers silently. I would venture to say that all worthwhile customers are far bigger and far more resourceful (including money) than freelance translators. Who should sponsor who?
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Creating layout from scratch using MS Word (Windows 10). Any good tutorials out there?






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