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Dutch to English translations [PRO] Social Sciences - Military / Defense / Executive MBA on organisa
Dutch term or phrase:gevangenencommando
In a work about concentration camp experiences, I have to translate the Dutch word 'commando' regularly into (British) English. I can often use the English 'detail', but I have now come across this expression 'gevangenencommando' which literally means 'prisoners command'. I do not think the word 'command' being used here in English is in the proper sense. The whole context of this expression is:
Het vrouwelijke gevangenencommando vertrok op 4 mei 1943 vanaf Ravensbrück en kwam op 8 mei 1943 in Stiermarken aan.
Does anyone have any idea how to translate this expression properly?
This expression occurs in a book (Ph D thesis) about the Holocaust which was originally published in (Austrian) German, and has already been translated into Dutch (Netherlands). The book is to be published in English.
Daarom gaat mijn voorkeur uit naar de originele ST in het Duits maar die kan ik nergens vinden. Uitgever zou eigenlijk een directe vertaling vanuit het Duits naar het Engels moeten uitvoeren!!!
I am afraid the term 'gevangenencommando' is an incorrect or inferior literal translation of the German 'Häftlingskommando', in which 'kommando' refers to 'a group of prisoners selected for a particular task'.
Has nothing to do with 'representatives'. The Nazis selected them to do this task and selected a leader of the group.
...the Sonderkommando, a prisoner detail charged with...
here you get your connotation of a 'gang'; transport, 'selected (representatives)' all in one. it's also fitting to instill a sense of external force here, too. 'Party'doesn't work because ...
However, shortly after the arrival of the prisoner detail, this work mission became pointless because VW, following talks with the Reich Air Ministry had decided to transfer the V1 production underground
This created more opportunities to carry out acts of violence against French prisoners and significantly reduced the opportunities for Frenchmen to be dispatched on lighter work details or acquire extra food rations.
Years later I learned what saved us. On October 7, 1944, the Sonderkommando, a prisoner detail charged with cremating the corpses after gassing, blew up the ovens in Crematorium IV.
it's generally "gang/crew of inmates", but in this particular sentence, suggesting transportation, it's rather "transport of female inmates" or "party of female inmates".
‘Solahütte (AKA Solehütte, Soletal, SS-Hütte Soletal, SS Hütte Porabka)[1] was a little-known resort for the Nazi German guards, administrators, and auxiliary personnel of the Auschwitz/Birkenau/Buna facilities. Because Auschwitz detainees overseen by Franz Hössler constructed the rustic getaway facility and a crew of detainees did ongoing grounds-keeping and cleanup work, Solahütte can be considered a tiny subcamp of Auschwitz.[2]’ (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solahütte )
See e.g. Linguee: Erstmals rücken jetzt Häftlingskommandos unter SS-Bewachung aus, um außerhalb des Lagers in Dachauer Wehrwirtschaftsbetrieben zu arbeiten. = For the first time, groups of prisoners accompanied by their SS guards leave the camp to work in other arms and war supply factories. (http://www.linguee.com/german-english/translation/häftlingsk... )
‘De Solahütte is een in Miedzybrodzie Bialskie, nabij Zywiec, gelegen rusthuis, dat tijdens het bewind van nazi-Duitsland door SS-leden gebruikt werd. Dit vakantieoord werd door een gevangenencommando uit concentratiekamp Auschwitz, dat onder leiding van Franz Hößler stond, in 1942 gebouwd.’ (http://nl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solahütte )
‘Dieses "Urlauberheim" wurde von einem Häftlingskommando des KZ Auschwitz 1942 unter der Leitung von dem späteren Schutzhaftlagerführer Franz Hößler ausgebaut. Es war von Herbst (Oktober/November) 1940 bis Januar 1945 in Betrieb; dabei wurden dort auch einige weibliche KZ-Häftlinge zur Zwangsarbeit eingesetzt (Arbeitskommando).’ (http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solahütte )
Exactly. And exactly because of that, "Het vrouwelijke gevangenencommando" does not mean not "ALL" women prisoners in this sencence, because -- as follows from the entire context of this pdf document you gave the link to -- women in that particular party were NOT only women either in Ravensbrück or in Stiermarken, neither before, nor after. Ravensbrück was a female camp, and the "commando" was only some of the women inmates transported to Stiermarken. It was just THE party.
You call it a "party" and I chose for "all prisoners".
I do not imagine things but read between the lines, that's what translators are supposed to do. You maybe right that you can use "party" for all cases but one can translate it more specifically for each individual case...
Evgeny Artemov (X)
South Africa
Stop imagining things.
10:45 May 30, 2014
In the KZ context, 'commando'/'Kommando' just can't mea anything but 'prisoners' gang', and this this particular sentence, it's definitely a (transportation) party. Fits perfectly.
Probably the inmates selected representatives anyways with or without permission. Could well be that the Germans asked for such themselves!
Sankt Lambrechts was NOT a Death Camp but a Sub Camp used by the Germans for recreational purposes! If you want bricklayers, carpenters etc. to work for you, you'd better keep them alive and it's easier for Otto to speak to one bricklayer than to all of them...
Evgeny Artemov (X)
South Africa
@freekfluweel
10:27 May 30, 2014
So you think Nazis permitted prisoners to form (elect??) "boards" of their own, elect "representatives" -- in DEATHCAMPS??
"Ook de vrouwelijke gevangenen, de Getuigen van Jehovah, herinnerden zich de wisseling van het hele gevangenencommando en hebben dat als ingrijpend en tragisch ervaren. De eigenlijke reden was waarschijnlijk geen vluchtpoging, maar het verraad van een geplande aanslag op commandant Schöller."
"Het nieuwe gevangenencommando was grotendeels samengesteld uit vaklieden."
The word "commando" is being used in this thesis as "order" AND "group" randomly:
"De vrouwen moesten afwegen of commando’s in overeenstemming waren met hun geloofsprincipes."
and sometimes used for:
all prisoners
"De geschiedenis van dit bedrijf van de Schutzstaffel en de situatie aldaar tot de aankomst van het vrouwelijke gevangenencommando, vormt de inhoud van het volgende hoofdstuk."
a group of female prisoners? Could also be 'guards' - 'a group of female guards' The context here is probably extended : you have to look at the whole paragraph, or even further.