verslechteringsvoorstellen

English translation: regressive bargaining / regressive proposals

11:50 May 31, 2018
Dutch to English translations [PRO]
Bus/Financial - Other / Trade union
Dutch term or phrase: verslechteringsvoorstellen
Dear all,

This terminology used in the context of trade union negotiations.

Thanks for quick response!
Edith Doove (X)
France
Local time: 11:42
English translation:regressive bargaining / regressive proposals
Explanation:
https://www.laborandcollectivebargaining.com/2015/04/article...
Selected response from:

Richard Purdom
Portugal
Local time: 10:42
Grading comment
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
5regressive bargaining / regressive proposals
Richard Purdom
4 +1proposed concessions; concessionary proposals
Kitty Brussaard
Summary of reference entries provided
context
Michael Beijer
Refs
Kitty Brussaard

Discussion entries: 24





  

Answers


10 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 5/5
regressive bargaining / regressive proposals


Explanation:
https://www.laborandcollectivebargaining.com/2015/04/article...

Richard Purdom
Portugal
Local time: 10:42
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Barend van Zadelhoff: 'regressive bargaining' seems to be one specific form of 'bad faith bargaining'. https://tinyurl.com/y9sjs8zl I expect 'verslechteringsvoorstellen' is broader than 'regressive bargaining' and 'bad-faith bargaining' could be a general designation for them.
16 hrs
  -> yeah I don't really get your point, are you proposing 'bad-faith bargaining'? Your interesting list lots which aren't 'voorstellen' at all. Why would you expect that? Have you got a constructive solution, or just cheering for failure? Have a nice weekend.

neutral  Kitty Brussaard: Both terms usually refer to a party changing its bargaining position during the process (@BvZ: in itself not evidence of bad faith) whereas the source term implies a step backward (for one of the parties) compared to the status quo prior to bargaining.
21 hrs
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7 days   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
proposed concessions; concessionary proposals


Explanation:
Posted post-closing for future reference and to follow up on the discussion around this term (see D-box and reference comments).

As of September 11, 2015, the employer has made no proposals that would yield significant improvements for TSSU members. Instead, many of their proposals seek to remove rights and protections our members currently have. Unions characterize proposals which take things away from members as concessions. Below is an outline of the employer’s current proposed concessions.
http://bargaining.tssu.ca/our-proposals/employer-proposals/

This settlement with Extendicare is our leading bargaining breakthrough in an admittedly tough round of negotiations in the long-term care sector.
This tentative agreement includes enhancements in wages, benefits, vacation and weekend premium.
But more importantly, your bargaining committee resisted employer-proposed concessions that would reduce your sick pay benefits, and eliminate all benefits for part-time employees.
https://www.unifor.org/sites/default/files/documents/documen...

Unifor Marine Workers Federation Local 1 represents about 800 workers at the shipyard, which is owned by Irving Shipbuilding.

The workers’ current collective agreement expires Dec. 31. The two sides met for four days last month before the company requested a provincial conciliator.

More than 700 workers attended a union meeting Sunday updating them on the contract talks.

In a statement posted on social media, Unifor said the bargaining committee walked members through 33 pages of concessionary proposals from the employer.

“After a healthy discussion,” members voted 99 per cent in favour of a strike, the union said.

“The bargaining team remains optimistic that the conciliator will be able to convince the employer that a confrontational and concessionary approach is not the best way to reach a tentative agreement,” the union statement said.
http://thechronicleherald.ca/business/1526218-halifax-shipya...

UFCW Local 832 in Manitoba had their first day of bargaining today with Sobeys and were presented with a set of concessionary proposals from the company that would “effectively gut the collective agreement,” according to Jeff Traeger Local 832 President.
http://www.ufcw247.com/global_news_template.cfm?page=0117201...

Kitty Brussaard
Netherlands
Local time: 11:42
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch
PRO pts in category: 16

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  sindy cremer
4 days
  -> Hartelijk dank!
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Reference comments


4 hrs peer agreement (net): +1
Reference: context

Reference information:
as far as I can tell, this is Asker's exact context:

"Cao onder druk?
Onderzoek naar ontwikkelingen van collectieve arbeidsverhoudingen in relatie tot de cao

[…]

Volgens de vakbonden zijn die ‘moderniseringsvoorstellen’ niets anders dan verslechteringen van de bestaande cao. Medio mei 2015 verhardt zich de toon van de vakbeweging en worden massaal acties voorbereid. “Werkgevers komen alleen met verslechteringsvoorstellen naar de cao-tafel, terwijl mensen al jaren hebben ingeleverd. Als werkgevers op die manier de aanval zoeken, als zij op die manier radicaliseren, komen onze leden in verzet en gaan we actie voeren”(VK 5/2015).

https://www.deburcht.nl/userfiles/file/Eindrapport onderzoek...

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Note added at 4 hrs (2018-05-31 16:05:41 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

how about "negative bargaining proposals". see e.g.:

"The NLRA prohibits bad faith bargaining ("surface bargaining"), but the law grants employers wide latitude to engage in tactics that frustrate negotiations and ultimately cause employees to give up their efforts at winning a union contract. Harvard Law School professor Paul Weiler identified ways in which employers can legally stave off a first contract. First, they can offer extremely negative bargaining proposals that fail to offer any improvements in wages or benefits, knowing that the union would never accept it."

(http://www.forworkingfamilies.org/sites/pwf/files/documents/... )

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day 2 hrs (2018-06-01 14:48:27 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Richard's ref.:

The National Labor Relations Board’s General Counsel’s Office, Division of Advice, has ordered dismissal of an unfair labor practice charge alleging bad faith “regressive” bargaining by a union. In this case, after the employees rejected decisively the employer’s final offer, the union bargaining team resumed negotiations with new demands and proposed modifications of previously agreed-upon items.



The Division also stated the union’s new demands, many of which addressed specific employee objections to the employer’s final offer, “… were not so ‘harsh, vindictive or otherwise unreasonable’ as to suggest they were offered in bad faith.” The Division further held the new and modified proposals reflected a strengthened bargaining position and thus a legitimate reason existed to seek improved terms the employees and the union could accept, thus, enhancing the possibility of reaching an agreement.

(https://www.laborandcollectivebargaining.com/2015/04/article... )

Michael Beijer
United Kingdom
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 28

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
neutral  philgoddard: How do you know this is the context?
51 mins
  -> from what she told us. I googled "verslechteringsvoorstellen" and looked for stuff in the context of "terminology used in the context of trade union negotiations."
agree  Barend van Zadelhoff: Of course, in trade union negotiations 'verslechteringsvoorstellen' will be made by the employers rather than by the unions; 'bad faith bargaining' may be a good option.
22 hrs
  -> Thank! Yes, that phrase "bad faith" [(te) kwade(r) trouw] has now popped up twice. It's also in Richard's ref. (which I just added to my own Reference comment)
neutral  Kitty Brussaard: Helpful refs, especially the first one, but 'bad faith bargaining' is really not the right translation here. See also my comment on Richard's answer. / Not to worry, just commenting on Barend's remark that 'bad faith bargaining' might be a good option.
1 day 3 hrs
  -> Thanks Kitty. Please note that I don't mean to suggest that the correct translation is "bad faith bargaining" (and neither did Richard, as far as I can tell). Just that it popped up twice. The closest I got was what I offered in my Discussion entries.
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3 days 4 hrs
Reference: Refs

Reference information:
Per 1 juli 2016 loopt de CAO voor het grondpersoneel af. In tegenstelling tot voorgaande jaren stuurde de KLM haar CAO-voorstellen voor het eerst niet vooraf naar de grondbonden maar koos het bedrijf ervoor om tijdens het overleg van 29 april jl. uit de doeken te doen welke arbeidsvoorwaardelijke maatregelen ze wil nemen.

In een lange presentatie toonde de KLM maar liefst 60 pagina's van verslechteringsvoorstellen. Als deze KLM-voorstellen doorgaan dan raken ze diep in de arbeidsvoorwaarden van het grondpersoneel.
https://www.vkp-belang.nl/inhoud/uploads/VHKP-Nieuwsbericht-...

Cao-onderhandelingen PostNL

Afgelopen vrijdag 12 februari hebben de vakorganisaties, waaronder de VHP2, en PostNL hun inzetbrieven uitgewisseld.
(...)
De inzetbrief van PostNL bevat een aantal verslechteringsvoorstellen die een stevige negatieve impact hebben op de arbeidsvoorwaarden van een groot deel van de werknemers.
https://www.vhp2.nl/nl/actueel/cao-onderhandelingen-postnl-4...

Gisteren startten de onderhandelingen voor een nieuwe cao Universitair Medisch Centra (UMC’s). De huidige cao loopt af op 1 mei 2015 en geldt voor 67.000 medewerkers. De FNV wil vooral goede afspraken maken over loonsverhoging, werkzekerheid en duurzame inzetbaarheid. Dit laatste vooral in combinatie met onregelmatigheidsdiensten. De werkgever wil alvast vooruit lopen op de wet m.b.t. de ambtenarenstatus. Ondanks dat de Eerste Kamer deze wet nog moet behandelen, stelt de werkgever al diverse verslechteringsvoorstellen voor.
https://www.medicalfacts.nl/2015/03/18/onderhandelingen-nieu...

Eind april hebben wij jullie geïnformeerd over de verslechteringsvoorstellen, die werkgevers hebben gedaan voor de cao Railinfra. We hebben toen aangekondigd een vergelijking te maken tussen wat werkgevers willen en de huidige cao.
https://www.fnvbouw.nl/actueel/nieuws/paginas/Dreiging_volle...

Kitty Brussaard
Netherlands
Native speaker of: Native in DutchDutch
PRO pts in category: 16
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