plant design/plant engineering

Chinese translation: 工厂设计 VS. 工厂工程/工厂设备(安装)工程

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)
English term or phrase:plant design VS. plant engineering
Chinese translation:工厂设计 VS. 工厂工程/工厂设备(安装)工程
Entered by: Adsion Liu

13:37 Jan 11, 2010
English to Chinese translations [PRO]
Tech/Engineering - Engineering (general) / Civil and Industrial Engineering
English term or phrase: plant design/plant engineering
the problem with the solution I've found, in my opinion, is that 工厂设计 stresses too much the word design and might be misunderstood it's about factories. 装置设计 has this "design meaning" inside too. I'm talking about the profession and 行业。In addition to this, in Italy the word I'm translating is different from the concept of installation. Well, at least it is similar but not exactly the same. Therefore even 工厂安装 in my opinion might be wrong as it contains the word 安装 and 工厂.
Similar stories for 设备安装 / 设备工程 ? am I thinking too much?!
kelis
Italy
Local time: 17:48
工厂设计/工厂工程
Explanation:
A plant may refer to a 装置 or a 工厂 that includes several 装置 which are related to each other. There are many design institutes (设计院) or engineering companies (工程公司) in different industries. Their job is to provide basic design (基础设计) and engineering design (工程设计) of a plant. When it comes to installation, it’s the job of a construction company (建设公司). I hope the above would be helpful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engineering
Engineering is the discipline, art and profession of acquiring and applying technical, scientific and mathematical knowledge to design and implement materials, structures, machines, devices, systems, and processes that safely realize a desired objective or inventions.


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Note added at 4 hrs (2010-01-11 18:29:14 GMT)
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In addition to 管工 and 电工 you mentioned, what I can think of right now is 钳工, 焊工, 木工, 瓦工, 起重工, 仪表工 and 油漆工.

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Note added at 6 hrs (2010-01-11 20:35:23 GMT)
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The 管工, 电工, 钳工, 焊工, 木工, 瓦工, 起重工, 仪表工 and 油漆工 may work for different industries, e.g., chemical industry, textile industry, food industry, etc.). However, their jobs are in the category of 建筑 & 安装.

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Note added at 12 hrs (2010-01-12 02:21:58 GMT)
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Keris, I am sorry, but I don’t think I quite understand your question. Could you please let me know the corresponding Italian text for “plant design/plant engineering”? The workers 管工, 电工, 钳工 and the like don't do any “plant design/plant engineering”. They just implement the design. It is engineers who do the job of “plant design/plant engineering”.

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Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2010-01-12 16:46:59 GMT)
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Keris, Thank you for your explanation. Based on your explanation, I would suggest to use 建筑物装修/施工.

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Note added at 4 days (2010-01-15 15:19:34 GMT)
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Kelis, "建筑物安装" could be misleading. “施工设备安装" might be misunderstood as “installation of construction equipment”. In my opinion, 建筑物施工/设备安装 should serve the purpose quite well. Of course, it’s up to you to decide.
Selected response from:

ysun
United States
Local time: 04:48
Grading comment
多谢!I decided for 设备安装
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
4工厂设计/工厂工程
ysun
3厂房设计业/厂房设计工业/厂房设计行
Daisy Zhu


  

Answers


3 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
工厂设计/工厂工程


Explanation:
A plant may refer to a 装置 or a 工厂 that includes several 装置 which are related to each other. There are many design institutes (设计院) or engineering companies (工程公司) in different industries. Their job is to provide basic design (基础设计) and engineering design (工程设计) of a plant. When it comes to installation, it’s the job of a construction company (建设公司). I hope the above would be helpful.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engineering
Engineering is the discipline, art and profession of acquiring and applying technical, scientific and mathematical knowledge to design and implement materials, structures, machines, devices, systems, and processes that safely realize a desired objective or inventions.


--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2010-01-11 18:29:14 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

In addition to 管工 and 电工 you mentioned, what I can think of right now is 钳工, 焊工, 木工, 瓦工, 起重工, 仪表工 and 油漆工.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 6 hrs (2010-01-11 20:35:23 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

The 管工, 电工, 钳工, 焊工, 木工, 瓦工, 起重工, 仪表工 and 油漆工 may work for different industries, e.g., chemical industry, textile industry, food industry, etc.). However, their jobs are in the category of 建筑 & 安装.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 12 hrs (2010-01-12 02:21:58 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Keris, I am sorry, but I don’t think I quite understand your question. Could you please let me know the corresponding Italian text for “plant design/plant engineering”? The workers 管工, 电工, 钳工 and the like don't do any “plant design/plant engineering”. They just implement the design. It is engineers who do the job of “plant design/plant engineering”.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 day3 hrs (2010-01-12 16:46:59 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Keris, Thank you for your explanation. Based on your explanation, I would suggest to use 建筑物装修/施工.

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 days (2010-01-15 15:19:34 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Kelis, "建筑物安装" could be misleading. “施工设备安装" might be misunderstood as “installation of construction equipment”. In my opinion, 建筑物施工/设备安装 should serve the purpose quite well. Of course, it’s up to you to decide.


    Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Engineering
ysun
United States
Local time: 04:48
Native speaker of: Chinese
PRO pts in category: 32
Grading comment
多谢!I decided for 设备安装
Notes to answerer
Asker: thank you ysun. So, what's the 行业 of the company(or people) which physically install this 装置? (水管工,电气技术工人,等等)

Asker: I'm sorry about keeping on stressing this question, probably it's me, it's that I cannot explain myself very well or maybe there's a difference between the two languages (Italian and Chinese). All these professions should belongs to an industry, right? Is there in Chinese a word that defines this industry (行业)? maybe 工厂安装?

Asker: I feel 安装 is the best solution. But if I try to translate "plant" into 工厂, (工厂安装) I might be misunderstood as the result might be that I refer to factory when in the source text's word contains also the house construction industry. Am I right?

Asker: ok then, I'm sorry for not having been enough clear. Actually the reason why we don't understand each other is due to the fact that this "plant design" might be correct (I cannot find any different translation, even here in proz.com) but it's a bit misleading. So, I'll try again. In Italian, the field of plant design/engineering is called "IMPIANTISTICA". of course there are engineers, designers who draw the plant, but actually this word refers to the workers who physically install the plant, the "IMPIANTISTI". IMPIANTISTI are actually plumbers and electricians, who work in the construction industry. (they are more specialized than common plumbers and electricians)Designers are not IMPIANTISTI. They are designers who work in the field of IMPIANTISTICA. I really hope this time it works. Sorry Ysun and thanks for your patience!

Asker: we might be close to the answer;)...装修 has this 修 inside that it's not really correct in my opinion..therefore, could it be 建筑物安装/施工设备安装? I really like the word 施工actaully

Asker: ok. thanks a lot!

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50 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
厂房设计业/厂房设计工业/厂房设计行


Explanation:
I cannot quite make out from your question wether it is the profession or the actual work you want the translation. I'v given a few options, hope they help. Perhaps you can post the original Italian phrase in to see if that can shed more light.

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Note added at 7 hrs (2010-01-11 21:22:18 GMT)
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In Chinese 行业 can mean both the trade, industry or business, or the profession or occupation, I think that might be the cause of all confusion. For example, if I were a lorry driver, I could say I work in the transport industry, and there are many other occupations/professions under the umbrella term 'transport industry'. Of course, in English the word 'profession' could mean both the job itself or the person who does the job. If your question is about the job itself, and the job is about designing a plant, then 厂房设计 or 工厂设计 could be the answer, the former emphasize designing the building itself, whilst the latter emphasize the designing of the factory or plant. Hope this note clarifies things a bit. Feel free to get back to me. Also, if you could post the original Italian text with English gloss under, I may have a better idea. I don't claim to speak Italian, but I have working knowledge of Spanish, and I think these two language have more similarities than say English and Italian or Italian and Chinese. Best wishes.

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Note added at 1 day6 hrs (2010-01-12 20:25:10 GMT)
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Your note has clarified things for me. I was mislead by your original post 'plant design/engineering'. May I now suggest 装潢 or 装潢工程?Best wishes.

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Note added at 4 days (2010-01-15 21:21:56 GMT)
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装潢 literally means 'to decorate', but in China it is a big industry that involves laying flooring, installing kitchens and bathrooms, installing built-in wardrobes and even beds, as well as interior decoration. Basically, 装潢公司 is willing to go the whole hog as long as you're prepared to pay for it.

Daisy Zhu
United Kingdom
Local time: 10:48
Native speaker of: Native in ChineseChinese
Notes to answerer
Asker: well, actually, it's a list of 行业. In my opinion the two more appropriate translations should be 工厂安装 or 设备安装. right before there's 建筑业、地板、屋顶 (I personally cannot figure it out why they talk about 行业 and than list 地板、屋顶). In your opinion,in a list of 行业, is it bad to read other words about profession, materials ect? I cannot post Italian into Chinese questions as few times I received a reply unfortunately. thank you Daisy

Asker: thank you Daisy, it's a clear-cut answer! well, the source text is a list of companies divided into "Settori merceologici"(product category) that I decided to translate into 行业列表。In this particular case, there's "edilizia, pavimenti, tetti, impiantisti" (construction, floor, roof...)" that is 建筑业、地板、屋顶, and this "impiantisti" which means the people who work in the field "plant design and installation". the thing is that in Italian "impiantista" is different from "installatore" (installer, the person who assemble e.g. 锅炉 that is not responsible for the 水管 because it's the "impiantista" job). keep in mind that the latter is just an example, this profession refers mainly to the construction industry. But it has nothing to do with design 设计.

Asker: 装潢 doesn't it mean mount something small, decorate?

Asker: Interesting, I didn't know that! thanks

Asker: I really want to thank you for your help Daisy, it has been a pleasure to discuss with you. 多谢!:)

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