keepers and kept

English translation: women who support themselves and women supported by someone else

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

English term or phrase:	keepers and kept
Selected answer:	women who support themselves and women supported by someone else
Entered by:	Lydia De Jorge

19:57 May 4, 2020

English language (monolingual) [PRO]
Art/Literary - Poetry & Literature

English term or phrase: keepers and kept

Dear colleagues,

I'm a bit embarrassed by a word play in the book I read now (This Immortal by R. Zelazny, if that matters). This is the description of a party attended by the protagonist:

"The ladies wore, or didn't, whatever they pleased, usually bright or accompanied by pastel simicoloring* (unless they were Staff, in which case they were neatly packed into short-skirted Dress Blacks...), which makes it somewhat easier to tell some of the KEEPERS FROM THE KEPT."

* A neologism for makeup.

This is scifi, it takes place in future, but neither "keepers" nor "kept" have anything to do with the fictional world (they are not some plot-related notions), this should be just a more or less mundane pun concerning the ladies' attire (which I do not get). I thought it has something to do with "kept women", but I'm not sure. Is there something obvious I miss not being a native speaker, or is it really a difficult-to-understand pun?

Thanks in advance.

Denys Dömin KudoZ activity Questions: 30 (none open) (1 closed without grading) Answers: 936 Ukraine
Local time: 10:22

women who support themselves and women supported by someone else

Explanation:
You are correct in assuming it has to do with 'kept women'. Those who support themselves (independent ones) can probably afford fewer luxuries than those that have someone to support (keep) them. Thus their attire would distinguish one from the other.

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Note added at 3 days 20 hrs (2020-05-08 16:25:24 GMT) Post-grading
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Glad I could help. I'm a keeper... ;)

Selected response from:

Lydia De Jorge
United States
Local time: 02:22

Grading comment

I'm not sure that your interpretation of "keepers" is correct, but I see your point and thank you for your help.
2 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

SUMMARY OF ALL EXPLANATIONS PROVIDED

4 +1

women who support themselves and women supported by someone else

Lydia De Jorge

staff and guests

Mark Nathan

Discussion entries: 6

Lydia De Jorge

United States

The difference I think is in the attire.

18:12 May 5, 2020

The 'keepers' wear classy, sophisticated clothing, while the 'kept' might be a bit trashy and provocative.

Lydia De Jorge

United States

@Denys

18:10 May 5, 2020

I have not read the book, so this is pure speculation... Often, when a woman is a professional who takes care of herself and depends on no one, she is referred to as 'a keeper' - meaning one would like to keep her in one's life. On the other hand, a 'kept woman' is often uneducated, but with enough good looks to get herself a wealthy man to support her.

Mark Nathan

France

"wore, or didn't"

13:12 May 5, 2020

This could mean that some of the women wore very little - the ones that were being sexually exploited - these would be the "kept women".

Denys Dömin

Ukraine

ASKER

Brothel keepers vs. kept women?

13:03 May 5, 2020

Thank you, everyone.
Hmm, it just came to my mind that I missed another important detail. The Earth women in that book are often sexually exploited, it's one of the keynotes of this novel ("exploited your countrymen, turned your world into a brothel"). So perhaps just "madams and prostitutes"? If we do suppose that the opposition is between different sorts of women in more or less different attire (not between the uniformed Staff and non-uniformed non-Staff of both sexes), does it make sense?

philgoddard

United States

20:29 May 4, 2020

All the hits for this relate either to zoos or prisons. I think the idea is that the keepers are the people in charge, perhaps with the implication that it's not always easy to distinguish them from the kept. I don't know if this fits with your context.

Denys Dömin

Ukraine

ASKER

Staff

20:25 May 4, 2020

I should have mentioned it in the question (sorry about this): Staff means that they are public servants (who must wear a black uniform), not waiters etc. (they were guests, too, but there were both uniformed guests, men and women belonging to the so called Staff, and the guests who "wore... whatever they pleased")

Answers

14 mins confidence:

staff and guests

Explanation:
On a very simple level, the staff are "keepers" because they keep the guests supplied with food, drink etc., they look after them.
And the guests are "kept" because they are kept happy by the staff.

That is how I understand it, but there may be more to it!

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Note added at 33 mins (2020-05-04 20:30:41 GMT)
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OK, well the same sense of "keepers" and "kept" still applies. Public servants provide services to the rest of the population. But this explains why it says "SOME OF the keepers from the kept": without the uniforms, it would have been difficult to identify the public servants in some cases.

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Note added at 34 mins (2020-05-04 20:32:10 GMT)
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Of course, depending on the nature of the regime, these public servants may have more power than the people they "serve".

Mark Nathan
France
Local time: 09:22
Meets criteria
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 88

Notes to answerer

Asker: Thanks! I should have mentioned it in the question (sorry about this): Staff means that they are public servants (who must wear a black uniform), not waiters etc. (they were guests, too, but there were both uniformed guests and the guests who "wore... whatever they pleased")

Asker: Seems legit, but is it in line with the sentence structure? I thought that the part about the Staff may be omitted (being in brackets): "The ladies wore, or didn't, whatever they pleased, usually bright or accompanied by pastel simicoloring, which makes it somewhat easier to tell some of the keepers from the kept". The page in question, just in case: https://www.rapidshare.com.cn/YlE3z0H

1 hr confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

women who support themselves and women supported by someone else

Lydia De Jorge
United States
Local time: 02:22
Meets criteria
Specializes in field
Native speaker of:

Spanish,

English
PRO pts in category: 2

Grading comment

I'm not sure that your interpretation of "keepers" is correct, but I see your point and thank you for your help.

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