sich mit einem Künstler auseinandersetzen

English translation: to engage with / respond critically to the work of an artist

GLOSSARY ENTRY (DERIVED FROM QUESTION BELOW)

German term or phrase:	sich mit einem Künstler auseinandersetzen
English translation:	to engage with / respond critically to the work of an artist
Entered by:	Helen Shiner

10:55 Mar 12, 2012

German to English translations [PRO]
Art/Literary - Art, Arts & Crafts, Painting

German term or phrase: sich mit einem Künstler auseinandersetzen

...enstand eine Fotoserie in der er sich mit Egon Schiele auseinandersetzte.

in which he closely examined the work of Egon Schiele

Sounds too lame for "sich auseinandersetzen" somehow

in which he exhaustively explored with the work of... ??

Grateful for any better suggestions

Lesley Robertson MA, Dip Trans IoLET KudoZ activity Questions: 262 (3 open) (3 without valid answers) (8 closed without grading) Answers: 193 Austria
Local time: 06:59

to respond critically to the work of an artist

Explanation:
or to explore critically the work of an artist (Ramey obviously offered 'explore' first

The response is, however, to the artist's work/oeuvre not to the artist himself. This always needs adjusting when translating GER-EN in my view.

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Note added at 42 mins (2012-03-12 11:38:23 GMT)
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Like Bob von Hallberg and Danielle Allen, I would urge us to pay more attention to that critical thinking which takes “creative” or “aesthetic” forms—the poem or painting, film or performance that executes its own form of critical inquiry into the conditions and controlling ideas of contemporary life, or the translation or new poem or painting that responds critically to another poem or painting.
http://www.uchicago.edu/research/jnl-crit-inq/issues/v30/30n...

"Critical Response is a structured process that allows responders to pay close attention to a particular piece of art, text or a performance.” This process is one that we as artists can use when dialoguing with a viewer about our art, or on our selves when we find ourselves engaged with someone else’s art that we may or may not “get”. Five questions are to be asked and responded to (with emphasis on “There are no wrong answers”) - The Critical Response Tool:
http://opd.mpls.k12.mn.us/sites/daf1e7b3-5a92-4df1-9b5c-6718...
http://creativityjourney.blogspot.com/2007/10/critical-respo...

Susan Wides: Hudson Valley: Mannahatta to Kaaterskill is a mid-career survey of Susan Wides’ investigation of New York City and its surrounding landscape in 50 large-scale photographs. This exhibition represents Wides’ fourteen-year study of the perception of place using sites from the urban-rural spectrum along the Hudson River. Wides’ exploration begins at the historical ‘source’, the Catskill /Hudson Valley region of the Hudson River School, and continues in suburban Westchester, and on to the city. With her camera, Wides creates a transformative vision expressing her intuitive and critical response to the landscape, cityscape, and social environment.
http://www.susanwides.com/

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Note added at 44 mins (2012-03-12 11:40:13 GMT)
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One could also more simply say 'to investigate Schiele's work and to respond in a series of photographs.'

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Note added at 2 days10 hrs (2012-03-14 21:27:18 GMT)
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How about, given the new context, 'to engage with'. A photoseries in which he engaged with the work of E Schiele?

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Note added at 2 days10 hrs (2012-03-14 21:34:19 GMT)
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There are few things more topical than war, and the art-world loves to reflect on the topical. The proliferation of biennials around the world is one of the structures perpetuating this trend, which ultimately filters down to museums and galleries. For me, the question is not about the legitimacy of this as a thematic for art, but more about the nature of the intention, the specific strategies employed by artists and institutions to engage with such subject matter, and the relationship to audiences. The UK, like any other nation (but perhaps as we’ve been more implicated in it over recent years), has had a lot of exhibitions and discussion events on this theme.
http://www.axisweb.org/dlForum.aspx?ESSAYID=18025

Numerous international exhibitions and biennials have borne witness to the range of contemporary art engaged with the everyday and its antecedents in the work of Surrealists, Situationists, the Fluxus group, and conceptual and feminist artists of the 1960s and 1970s. This art shows a recognition of ordinary dignity or the accidentally miraculous, an engagement with a new kind of anthropology, an immersion in the pleasures of popular culture, or a meditation on what happens when nothing happens. The celebration of the everyday has oppositional and dissident overtones, offering a voice to the silenced and proposing possibilities for change.
http://mitpress.mit.edu/catalog/item/default.asp?tid=11411&t...

Portraiture itself is an ancient, and often rather conservative, practice. Oxford Art Online, a widely accepted academic source, cites a 1974 British Museum catalog that defines a portrait as an image “in which the artist is engaged with the personality of his sitter and is preoccupied with his or her characterization as an individual.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/05/01/nyregion/in-these-portrait...

You could then use it as a counterpoint to 'immersed himself in' in the next sentence/paragraph.

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Note added at 6 days (2012-03-19 08:38:10 GMT) Post-grading
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Thanks, Lesley. Glad it occurred to me at the last!

Selected response from:

Helen Shiner
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:59

Grading comment

Thank you Helen. I went with "engage with".
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

3 +5

delved into/explored/probed into/confronted himself with

Ramey Rieger (X)

4 +4

to deal with/interact with

Kirsten Bodart

3 +4

analysed the work of

Wendy Streitparth

3 +4

to respond critically to the work of an artist

Helen Shiner

examined, analyzed and discussed the work of .....

Mary Roberts

dedicated himself to the analysis of

Randall Nall

3 +1

...in which he *took on* the work of...

Stephen Reader

with reference to, based on, inspired by, investigated, explored, influenced by,

thefastshow

2 +1

grapple with the work of an artist

Nicola Wood

to focus on / to address (the works) of xy

Gert Sass (M.A.)

Discussion entries: 8

Helen Shiner

United Kingdom

@Horst

21:35 Mar 14, 2012

Yes, it is an engagement with - a reciprocal confrontation with the work.

Horst Huber (X)

United States

The German phrase is

16:06 Mar 13, 2012

elliptical, obviously. It should be unpacked as "mit dem Werk von ... auseinandersetzen", which is understood if the name is given, e.g. "mit Thomas Mann". "Mit einem (oder: dem) Künstler auseinandersetzen" denotes a personal confrontation.

Ramey Rieger (X)

Germany

ME, again

20:28 Mar 12, 2012

the word "fathomed" just occurred to me - thought I'd share that.

Ramey Rieger (X)

Germany

Hello Lesley

17:37 Mar 12, 2012

In this case, I would suggest "explored" or "probed into" for "auseinandersetzte", since he was "magically attracted to" Schiele, even "absorbing" his style. And now, in London, he once more "delves into"......I understand it as a highly inuitive/magnetic/creative process. Hope this is of some assistance.

Lesley Robertson MA, Dip Trans IoLET

Austria

ASKER

@Brigitte

13:34 Mar 12, 2012

Hier mehr Kontext:
In 1996 entstand eine Fotoserie, in der er sich mit Egon Schiele auseinandersetzte. Schieles Werk hatte schon früher einen magischen Einfluss auf den jungen Künstler ausgeübt, sodass er sich zeitweilig dessen Malstil aneignete. In der Londoner Fotoserie imaginierte er sich nun noch einmal in Schiele hinein – mit Hilfe des Mediums der Fotografie.

Ramey Rieger (X)

Germany

As a singer,

11:58 Mar 12, 2012

when I "setzte mich mit einer Sängerin auseinander", I study not only her tonality (or lack of it), but also her phrasing, her breath control , her pronunciation and her "show". As a professional artist, it is much more than a theoretical experience, but an absorption of the object of my interest, an integration of those qualities which I chose to adopt, adapt, ingest and eventually call my own. Perhaps "absorbed" would be closer?

Helen Shiner

United Kingdom

@Brigitte

11:54 Mar 12, 2012

Although its use is extremely normal and often used in such contexts. You are right, though, to say that EN might need more precision. My suggestion represents an equally frequently used formulation in EN!

BrigitteHilgner

Austria

Das Problem ...

11:49 Mar 12, 2012

besteht darin, dass der Begriff "auseinandersetzen" im Deutschen so unendlich vage ist. Was hat der Fotograf denn gemacht? (Geht es um die Person Schiele oder dessen Werk?) Collagen? Gemälde von Schiele irgendwie verfremdet? Einzelauspekte herausgegriffen? Die Verben "to examine" und "to analyse" sind sicherlich richtig, greifen aber wahrscheinlich zu kurz. Gibt es mehr Kontext? Dann fiele eine sinnvolle Antwort leichter.

Answers

8 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

grapple with the work of an artist

Explanation:
If you want to keep something of the figurative image, suggesting it is no easy task

Alternatives for that might be tackle, attempt to get to grips with.

Nicola Wood
Austria
Local time: 06:59
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English
PRO pts in category: 4

4 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

analysed the work of

Explanation:
-

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Note added at 9 mins (2012-03-12 11:04:56 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

or better

analysing the work o/devoted to the work of

Wendy Streitparth
Germany
Local time: 06:59
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 8

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Randall Nall: sorry, wendy, i see your note says basically the same thing as my suggestion.

23 mins

-> Thanks Randall - no problem.

neutral

Helen Shiner: Slightly problematic in that the response is in the form of a series of photos. Analysis is part of it but not all, I think./Sorry, but I am definitely not keen on 'devoted to' but our Asker might well prefer it.

28 mins

-> I agree, I would also go for my second suggestion "devote".

agree

Stephen Reader: w/ devoted cos allows t' intuitive suggested in additional context @ 'Discussion'; & w/Helen

3 hrs

-> Thanks, Stephen. Am also in favour of devoted, but it occurred too late!

agree

Cilian O'Tuama: I like "devoted" here

10 hrs

-> Thanks, Cilian

agree

Paul Cohen: Was für eine Qual der Wahl! Plenty of creative suggestions, but I'm with "devoted" here.

13 hrs

-> Many thanks, Paul - hope you're recovering from the dilemma!

12 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +5

delved into/explored/probed into/confronted himself with

Explanation:
take your pick - or not - as you like.

Ramey Rieger (X)
Germany
Local time: 06:59
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 12

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

BrigitteHilgner: Given the additional information provided by the asker, I think "explore" might fit here, followed by "delved into" (imaginiert sich hinein).

2 hrs

-> Thank you Brigitte, yes, more than one will be needed.

agree

Stephen Reader: W/ delve, given Lesley's 'mehr Kontext' in Discussion section - where impression is more of intuitive than analyt. procedure (then again, there's intuitive analysis?)

2 hrs

-> Thanks Stephen, yes, there is intuitive analysis - strange, but true.

agree

Eleanore Strauss: Agree with explore, but there should be more. Another suggestion here of "grappled" with seems like one of the terms that is very appropriate. Confronted himself with is incorrect usage

3 hrs

-> Thanks ElliCom, yes, yes and yes, I think a rephrasing of the source text will be necessary

agree

philgoddard: Minus the "himself with".

4 hrs

-> yea, that sorta blew the roll I was on! Thanks, Phil, enjoy.

agree

hazmatgerman (X): explored

10 hrs

-> Why, thank you Mr.!

15 mins confidence:

examined, analyzed and discussed the work of .....

Explanation:
I think you examine the art, make an analysis and then discuss the piece of art

Mary Roberts
Local time: 00:59
Native speaker of:

German

23 mins confidence:

dedicated himself to the analysis of

Explanation:
entering the fray!

Reference: http://tinyurl.com/88m5zyk

Randall Nall
Local time: 06:59
Native speaker of: English

21 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

to deal with/interact with

Explanation:
In terms of art, an artist gets struck by the work of another and 'deals' with it in an emotional way. In a LEO discussion the term 'interaction' was mentioned which I find rather fitting.

An artist will incorporate the issues and maybe style or so that he found the artist he was struck by was addressing and thus will 'mold' this into his own. I think interacting it used in this way in art.

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Note added at 27 mins (2012-03-12 11:23:36 GMT)
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So '[the artist] produced/created a series of photos in which he interacted with the work of (painter) Egon Schiele.'
I think 'entstand' here is the German making the photos the subject, as the German likes to do. In English it is the artist who is the subject usually.

Kirsten Bodart
United Kingdom
Local time: 06:59
Works in field
Native speaker of:

Dutch,

English

3 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

...in which he *took on* the work of...

Explanation:
Just another variant for his 'engagement with'... (& there's another), without making it necessarily consciously 'analytical', since the context we have so far wd suggest an intuitive/committed/identifying process. @ Lesley, of course, the remaining surrounding text may swing you back towards 'critical', 'analytical', etc. Greetings/S.

Stephen Reader
Local time: 06:59
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 115

9 hrs confidence:

with reference to, based on, inspired by, investigated, explored, influenced by,

Explanation:
you could either choose to express it indirectly : he produced a photo series based on (inspired by/influenced by) the works of Egon Schiele (or just Egon Schiele if he picked the artist himself as a theme)

or use the terminology I could read in my assignments at uni : he "investigated" the works of Egon Schiele; in which he "explored" the oevre of Egon Schiele; "influenced" by the works; or also quite nice : "with reference" to Egon Schiele...

ok, nuff said .. I'll look up some more if you like :))

thefastshow
Germany
Local time: 06:59
Works in field
Native speaker of: German

1 day 6 hrs confidence:

to focus on / to address (the works) of xy

Explanation:
These are the most natural which come to mind IMO. I also like "to fathom", "probe", etc., but these would more closely correspond to other German expressions (ergründen, auf den Grund gehen, erforschen, etc.), whereas "sich auseinandersetzen" is pretty standard usage in this context.

Gert Sass (M.A.)
Germany
Local time: 06:59
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: German
PRO pts in category: 8

19 mins confidence:

peer agreement (net): +4

to respond critically to the work of an artist

Helen Shiner
United Kingdom
Local time: 05:59
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 275

Grading comment

Thank you Helen. I went with "engage with".

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sich mit einem Künstler auseinandersetzen

English translation: to engage with / respond critically to the work of an artist

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