heilsgeschichtlich

English translation: in salvation-historical terms

13:45 Feb 16, 2016
German to English translations [PRO]
Social Sciences - History
German term or phrase: heilsgeschichtlich
Dennoch betrachteten die christlichen Franken ihr militärisches Vorgehen als legitime Rückeroberung von Gebieten, die einst unter christlicher Herrschaft gestanden hatten. Insbesondere im Falle des Heiligen Landes und Jerusalems wurde die Rückeroberung als heilsgeschichtliche Notwendigkeit gesehen.
Katie Schober
English translation:in salvation-historical terms
Explanation:
googles not too poorly

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Note added at 1 hr (2016-02-16 14:49:18 GMT)
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"redemptive-historical" googles best
Selected response from:

Jonathan MacKerron
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
2 +4in salvation-historical terms
Jonathan MacKerron
3 +2historico-redemptive terms
gangels (X)
4 +1a means to salvation
philgoddard
Summary of reference entries provided
The Crusades
Clive Phillips

Discussion entries: 2





  

Answers


41 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +2
historico-redemptive terms


Explanation:
I'd call it

gangels (X)
Local time: 12:24
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish, Native in GermanGerman
PRO pts in category: 4

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Michael Martin, MA: I just wanted to post something along the lines of "historic redemptive (religious) duty"
3 mins

neutral  philgoddard: English doesn't use this construction, putting "o" on the end of the first word, very much.
1 hr

agree  Helen Shiner: This would be fine, though for comprehension sake, maybe could do with unpacking a bit.
22 hrs
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26 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 2/5Answerer confidence 2/5 peer agreement (net): +4
in salvation-historical terms


Explanation:
googles not too poorly

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 1 hr (2016-02-16 14:49:18 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

"redemptive-historical" googles best

Jonathan MacKerron
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 47
Grading comment
Selected automatically based on peer agreement.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Wendy Streitparth: In terms of salvation history?
1 hr

agree  Rebecca Garber: as necessary for salvation history
1 hr

agree  William Howden: Agree especially with Rebecca - "salvation history" is the standard translation for Heilsgeschichte (but there is no adjectival form that is not awkward.
4 hrs

agree  Johanna Timm, PhD: with Wendy; https://goo.gl/khTHtt
6 hrs

neutral  Helen Shiner: Really sorry, but this sounds like a translation from the German. This hyphened use of historical is only ever used by translators or would-be translators, never by EN-speaking academics.
22 hrs
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +1
a means to salvation


Explanation:
I don't disagree with Jonathan's "salvation history", which Wikipedia defines as follows:

"Salvation history (in German Heilsgeschichte) seeks to understand the personal redemptive activity of God within human history to effect his eternal saving intentions."

However, this is a history text, and unless your readers are experts in theology they won't understand the term. I'd never heard of it until just now. If you're writing for general readers, I suggest that you say "a means to salvation" or something similar. This is taking slight liberties, but I think it conveys the meaning more effectively.


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Note added at 2 hrs (2016-02-16 16:21:51 GMT)
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If you wanted to keep the idea of history, you could say "a historical necessity and a means to salvation".


    Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salvation_History
philgoddard
United States
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 76

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Lancashireman: Agree that most readers will be stumped by 'salvation history' (the history of salvation?). Your unpacked version at 2 hours works much better.
10 hrs
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Reference comments


8 hrs peer agreement (net): +2
Reference: The Crusades

Reference information:
"The Crusades were a series of religious and political wars fought between 1096 and 1291 for control of the Holy Land. Pope Urban II initiated the First Crusade (1096–1102) in order to aid the Christian Byzantine Empire, which was under attack by Muslim Seljuk Turks. As a result of this crusade, Europeans [mostly Franks] captured Jerusalem in 1099."
"Christians understood the Crusades as a path to salvation for those who participated. As the French monk Guilbert of Nogent wrote in his twelfth century chronicle of the Crusades, “God has instituted in our time holy wars, so that the order of knights and the crowd running in its wake… might find a new way of gaining salvation. And so they are not forced to abandon secular affairs completely by choosing the monastic life or any religious profession, as used to be the custom, but can attain in some measure God’s grace while pursuing their own careers, with the liberty and in the dress to which they are accustomed.” Those who “took up the cross” were recipients of both spiritual and earthly rewards. The spiritual reward was the indulgence, or the forgiveness, of sins. The earthly rewards included plunder from conquest, forgiveness of debts, and freedom from taxes, as well as fame and political power."
"While there were additional motivations for taking up the cross—opportunity for economic or political gain, desire for adventure, and the feudal obligation to follow one’s lord into battle—to become a soldier for Christ was to express total devotion to God. According to historian Jonathan Riley-Smith, taking up the cross was based on Christ’s statement: “Whoever doth not carry his cross and come after me, cannot be my disciple” (Luke 14. 27). Underscoring this belief, priests encouraged participation in the Crusades by praising acts of devotion to God and invoking fear of the last judgment for failure to act."
I would tend towards a rendering of 'heilsgeschichtliche Notwendigkeit' as something along the lines of 'a necessary part of God's plan of salvation and restoration'. In my view, the reader's understanding would not be helped by the use of terms such as 'history' and 'salvation history' here.


    Reference: http://dcc.newberry.org/collections/the-crusades-motivations...
Clive Phillips
United Kingdom
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish

Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  Lancashireman: Agree, but it looks like 'salvation history' is unstoppable on +4.
4 hrs
  -> Thank you, Lancashireman.
agree  philgoddard: It sounds like you agree with my answer :-)
17 hrs
  -> A means to salvation for the individual, yes, but I think the author is saying that the re-conquest of the Holy Land and Jerusalem was regarded as essential to God's plan of salvation and restoration for humanity.
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