на что человеку общее?

English translation: What use does man have for the general?

09:54 Jul 10, 2018

Russian to English translations [PRO]
Science - General / Conversation / Greetings / Letters

Russian term or phrase: на что человеку общее?

Not specifically scientific, but occurs in a scientific text on the sociology of thinking in a statement about the knowledge of individual things being the ideal of any knowledge:

если не к этому стремится человеческое познание, тогда остается совершенно загадочным, на что человеку общее?

"if human knowledge is not striving for that, then it remains completely enigmatic..."

Jeff Skinner KudoZ activity Questions: 111 (none open) (19 closed without grading) Answers: 30 Sweden
Local time: 22:12

English translation:What use does man have for the general?

Explanation:
This is how I read it in the absence of any other context.

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Note added at 1 day 4 hrs (2018-07-11 14:34:37 GMT)
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Yes, this is exactly what I thought it would be. These look like someone's musings on the standard epistemological question of the individual v. the general. It has nothing to do with "what humans have in common".

Selected response from:

The Misha
Local time: 16:12

Grading comment

After having gone through the paragraph several times, I think this comes closest to the intended sense.
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer

Summary of answers provided

3 +2

what common ground does mankind share at all?

Daniel Price

3 +1

What use does man have for the general?

The Misha

then why would humans care for anything universal? (for what they call "universal")

IrinaN

4 -1

what is common for humans? / what humans have in common?

Turdimurod Rakhmanov

why humans should have so many common things

Andrew Vdovin

Summary of reference entries provided

for what human beings have in common?

Turdimurod Rakhmanov

Discussion entries: 2

Jeff Skinner

Sweden

ASKER

Per readers' request - more context

13:22 Jul 11, 2018

Рационалистическая философия, а также и философия эмпиризма считали представления недостаточными для целей познания на том основании, что представления якобы дают лишь знание единичных вещей и отделных событий и что сверх того необходимо еще знание общего, которое обеспечивается только лишь общими понятиями.

На это следует заметить, что, во-первых, наглядные представления вовсе не дают знания единичных вещей, а, во-вторых, знание единичного не так уж худо, как это представлялось философам. Напротив, это не только не плохо, но составляет идеал всякого знания: быть в состоянии вполне угадать индивидуальную природу явлений, т. е. познавать действительность – если не к этому стремится человеческое познание, тогда остается совершенно загадочным, на что человеку общее? И если бы человек в самом деле мог вполне угадывать в каждом отдельном случае индивидуальную природу явлений, то ему не к чему были бы общие абстрактные знания о каком-то «предмете вообще». Между отдельным и общим нет никакой проблемы в той постановке, которая нам известна из истории философии, ибо общее не имеет самобытного существования.

Susan Welsh

United States

more context

11:41 Jul 10, 2018

might help. Could you give the whole sentence, and maybe the ones before and after?

Answers

39 mins confidence:

why humans should have so many common things

Explanation:
Мутная фраза. Посему это лишь предположение.

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Note added at 40 mins (2018-07-10 10:35:22 GMT)
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why there are so many common things between people.

Andrew Vdovin
Local time: 03:12
Works in field
Native speaker of:

Russian
PRO pts in category: 83

3 hrs confidence:

then why would humans care for anything universal? (for what they call "universal")

Explanation:
Very ambiguous and somewhat pompous sentence indeed, sounds like junk science. Knowing what hides under "к этому" could help. What does the mankind strive for in the author's view?

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Note added at 4 hrs (2018-07-10 14:04:23 GMT)
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or "for anything in common"

IrinaN
United States
Local time: 15:12
Works in field
Native speaker of:

Russian
PRO pts in category: 12

4 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): -1

what is common for humans? / what humans have in common?

Explanation:
The whole sentence is not QW form. I believe that, it is a rhetoric question.
what is common for humans? / what humans have in common?
So,
if human knowledge is not striving (for that) for "what human beings have in common" (for what we have in common or for what is common for human beings), then it remains completely enigmatic...what (things) humans have in common?
In other words, if one person does not know about his own feelings or senses and perception, it means that he or she does not know about the feelings or senses of others. Which means, he does not know and realize what is in common.

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Note added at 5 hrs (2018-07-10 15:04:53 GMT)
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здесь скорее всего, речь идет о "ясном сознание", или абсолютном познании
clear realization, recognition-it seems to me so.

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Note added at 5 hrs (2018-07-10 15:07:27 GMT)
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ясном сознании

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Note added at 5 hrs (2018-07-10 15:10:17 GMT)
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So it is:
if human knowledge is not striving (for clear realization or recognition or perception,) or for realizing individual things, then it remains completely enigmatic...what (things) humans have in common?

Turdimurod Rakhmanov
Kyrgyzstan
Local time: 02:12
Works in field
Native speaker of:

Uzbek,

Kirghiz
PRO pts in category: 28

8 hrs confidence:

peer agreement (net): +1

What use does man have for the general?

The Misha
Local time: 16:12
Native speaker of:

Russian
PRO pts in category: 88

Grading comment

After having gone through the paragraph several times, I think this comes closest to the intended sense.

Notes to answerer

Asker: This feels right in the context, but please take a look at the full paragraph above and let me know what you think!

1 hr confidence:

peer agreement (net): +2

what common ground does mankind share at all?

Explanation:
or “what does mankind have in common?”

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Note added at 7 hrs (2018-07-10 17:22:31 GMT)
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In response to Turdimurod --

Thanks for the question! I found it valuable to ask myself the question "why?" so thanks for giving me a chance to think a little deeper.

After looking over your proposed translation vs mine, I think the difference is that I am treating the last phrase like a standalone question.

Hopefully, I can clearly explain why I chose to treat it as a question.

An Enigma is something that is mysterious or hard to understand. With the emphasis being on something. Questions generally aren't enigmatic (we know what the question is, we asked it after all) it is the answer that remains a mystery.

The translation the asker provided read as follows:
"if human knowledge is not striving for that, then it remains completely enigmatic..."

In that phrase it is the thing that is enigmatic. So, to complete the sentence, I supplied the question, who's answer is enigmatic. What does mankind have in common?

Note that the answer to that question could be a list that starts with "What humans have in common" which was your recommendation.

That recommendation will work as well, except that is the answer to the question not the question itself. So, it would be best to modify the asker's original translation as follows:

"if human knowledge is not striving for that, then what humans have in common remains completely enigmatic." Basically, just replace "it" with your translation because "it" (or what humans have in common) is the thing that is enigmatic.

Long story short, both translations could work it is just a difference of where you put it in the sentence and if you treat the sentence like a question or a statement. I tend to prefer my translation because it preserves the question mark. (And the "does" is what turns it from a statement into a question.)

I really hope that makes sense! Feel free to message me if it doesn't.

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Note added at 12 hrs (2018-07-10 22:16:15 GMT)
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Please make sure you review "The Misha's" translation as well as my translation in the comment of his translation. To see if that better matches the rest of the context.

"If human knowledge does not strive for that (understanding specific applications), than it (human knowledge) remains enigmatic, for what use are generalities to a man."

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Note added at 1 day 5 hrs (2018-07-11 15:21:31 GMT)
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I think that The Misha is right here. Though I would phrase it more like I did in the comments of his answer.
For what use then does man have of generalities?

If general principles don’t help understand reality, then they are useless.

I say true Kudos to “The Misha” for seeing what everyone else missed and having the guts to speak up about it. Well done The Misha!

Daniel Price
United States
Local time: 14:12
Works in field
Native speaker of:

English

Notes to answerer

Asker: I've provided the full paragraph in the discussion above. Right now I'm tending more to the "what use does humanity have for generalities?" than your suggestion, but please take a look and let me know what you think.

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)

agree

Jack Doughty

2 hrs

-> Thanks Jack!

agree

Natalia Potashnik

2 hrs

-> Thanks Natalia!

neutral

Turdimurod Rakhmanov: IMHO, no need for "does" in here. How would you explain "на" что then, стремиться на... It doesn't say "что человеку общее", but "на что человеку общее"?

2 hrs

-> In this phrase "does" is definitely required. There may be a way to phrase this similarly that doesn't require the word "does" but in the phrase as it stands it is definitely needed. -Hey Turdimurod, I just posted a note that I hope answers your question.

neutral

The Misha: I think you & everyone else are misinterpreting this. Metink, this is about the general vs the specific dichotomy rather than about any commonality humans may share.

6 hrs

-> I think that is a definite possibility... I left a comment on your response. I definitely think more context would help here.

Reference comments

10 mins

Reference: for what human beings have in common?

Reference information:
Whole sentence would be:
if human knowledge is not striving (for that) for what human beings have in common (for what we have in common or for what is common for human beings), then it remains completely enigmatic...

https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-ab&ei=bINEW4usAYSnsgHLmJzQCA&q=what+is+common+for+human+being&oq=what+is+common+for+human+bei

Turdimurod Rakhmanov
Kyrgyzstan
Works in field
Native speaker of:

Uzbek,

Kirghiz
PRO pts in category: 28

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на что человеку общее?

English translation: What use does man have for the general?

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на что человеку общее?

English translation: What use does man have for the general?

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