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  3. Certificates, Diplomas, Licenses, CVs

unicamente para surtir efectos fuera del territorio nacional

English translation: only valid outside the national territory

21:02 May 7, 2020
Spanish to English translations [Non-PRO]
Law/Patents - Certificates, Diplomas, Licenses, CVs
Spanish term or phrase: unicamente para surtir efectos fuera del territorio nacional
Cuban birth certificate
barrycat
United States
English translation:only valid outside the national territory
Explanation:
https://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/certificates-d...

and experience
Selected response from:

Jane Martin
Local time: 23:56
Grading comment
4 KudoZ points were awarded for this answer



Summary of answers provided
3 +5only valid outside the national territory
Jane Martin
4 +2valid only outside Cuba
philgoddard
3to be effectual outside Cuban national territory only
Adrian MM.
3solely to take effect abroad / solely for purposes of authentication abroad
Robert Carter


  

Answers


12 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): +5
only valid outside the national territory


Explanation:
https://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/certificates-d...

and experience

Jane Martin
Local time: 23:56
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 64

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  Rachel Gibson
25 mins
  -> Thank you.
agree  Maria Kisic
1 hr
  -> Thank you Maria
agree  AllegroTrans
1 hr
  -> Thank you.
agree  Toni Castano: The source doesn´t read "fuera de Cuba", but just "fuera del territorio nacional". It´s important to stick to it. It´s an official certificate.
5 hrs
  -> Thank you.
agree  Katherine Coelho
6 hrs
  -> Thanks Katherine.
neutral  Lester Tattersall: Yes...but I can understand Phil's reluctance: 1)we don't use the term "national territory" in this way in English (UK) 2) practically every piece of land in the world is, theoretically, 'national territory' (except Greenland, which is 'sub-national'.
7 hrs
  -> Thank you for your input - and I thought this was a simple one.
neutral  Robert Carter: Hi Jane. I don't think this is actually the meaning, plus I agree with Lester (and Phil) about "territorio nacional".
1 day 10 hrs
  -> Thanks Robert. I had always thought this was an easy one, but look how much debate it has caused.
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15 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
to be effectual outside Cuban national territory only


Explanation:
An authentic notarial wording might be: 'to serve and avail outside of Cuba only'. For instance, I had a qualification outisde the UK as a Brit. Comm. lawyer, but it was still very much valid in E&W.

There is a difference between being valid - it still is on Cuba - and taking effect outside (Scots: outwith) the main island plus La Isla de Juventud.

surtir efecto: to take effect; to be effective (West)






Example sentence(s):
  • ----the said Notary,.... have granted these presents under my Notarial firm and Seal of Office to *serve and avail as occasion shall or may require*

    Reference: http://eng.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/education-pedag...
    Reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notarial_act
Adrian MM.
Austria
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 52

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Toni Castano: Overinterpretation of the source IMO!
2 hrs
  -> Just paying 'Cuban' lip service to a previous accepted ProZ answer that the new asker never searched for: https://eng.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/education-peda...
neutral  AllegroTrans: It doesn't say "Cuban territory" even though clearly implied, and this can be translated adequately as per Jane M; you are to wedded (welded) to London Scrivener Notary lingo
3 hrs
  -> Just paying 'Cuban' lip service to a previous accepted ProZ answer that the new asker never searched for: https://eng.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/education-peda...
neutral  Robert Carter: Kudos for being the only one to have noticed the nuance of "for use outside Cuba", but you've still added "only"; whereas I think the certification is really "only issued for that purpose" (i.e., not for any other internal one).
1 day 5 hrs
  -> Yes. You're right, though I had a problem with 1. the pre-existing ProZ (glossary) entry that also mistakenly gravitates towards 'valid' when recognisable (as proof) on Cuba itself & 2. the stylistic balance of issued 'solely to be effectual outside...'.
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15 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5 peer agreement (net): +2
valid only outside Cuba


Explanation:
I don't disagree with Jane's answer, but I just think this is more concise and elegant.

philgoddard
United States
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 190

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
agree  patinba: Me too.
1 hr
neutral  Toni Castano: Careful with this translation in an official certificate!
2 hrs
  -> Why?
agree  Luis M. Sosa: Strongly agree.
2 hrs
neutral  AllegroTrans: It doesn't say "Cuba" even though clearly implied, and this can be translated adequately as per Jane M
3 hrs
  -> I believe my version reads better and is equally accurate.
neutral  Robert Carter: I agree with you about "Cuba", but not about the meaning. Logically, that would mean it's invalid within Cuba, and I don't think that's the case.
1 day 7 hrs
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1 day 23 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
solely to take effect abroad / solely for purposes of authentication abroad


Explanation:
There's a nuance that Adrian spotted here, in that the certification doesn't actually invalidate the document within Cuba, it simply invests it with authenticity for international purposes (I am assuming that this legend is not actually part of the birth certificate, but part of some legalization certification attached to it).

If you have a document issued in a certain country, and you then apply to the authorities of that country for an apostille or legalization certificate so that it can be presented and deemed authentic in another country, the apostille or legalization that is issued does not invalidate the original document or indeed the certification attached to it (apostille/legalization), in which case the wording here does not mean "only valid outside Cuba", it means "solely to take effect outside Cuba" or to put it another way, "solely for purposes of authentication abroad".

"An Apostille is simply the name for a specialized certificate, issued by the Secretary of State. The Apostille is attached to your original document to verify it is legitimate and authentic so it will be accepted in one of the other countries who are members of the Hague Apostille Convention."
https://www.internationalapostille.com/what-is-an-apostille/

By the way, I also agree that the meaning of "territorio nacional" is "Cuba" here; I have been using the same approach to this term for more than twenty years with documents issued in Mexico. "National territory" is meaningless to most English speakers, but "territorio nacional" is completely recognizable as "Mexico" to someone living in Mexico (or as "Cuba" to Cubans, etc.).

Robert Carter
Mexico
Local time: 16:56
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 245
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