"Homicidio premeditado en concurso real"

12:41 Nov 16, 2020
This question was closed without grading. Reason: Other

Spanish to English translations [PRO]
Law/Patents - Law (general) / Criminal law
Spanish term or phrase: "Homicidio premeditado en concurso real"
Hola a todos, espero que estén muy bien.
La frase que consulto pertenece a un diálogo entre un convicto y la asistente social. Ella le pregunta cuál es la condena, él responde 15 años, y ella dice:
-¿Homicidio simple?
él responde:
-"Homicidio premeditado en concurso real".
No sé cuál sería la traducción para esta figura legal, si es que existe tal cosa en el código penal estadounidense. En caso contrario la sentencia más aproximada también puede funcionar. No es un documento legal sino un film documental, la idea es plantear un panorama sobre la situación de los convictos. Los tecnicismos no son fundamentales.
Muchas gracias desde ya.
M
Mercedes Rizzuti
Local time: 11:24


Summary of answers provided
4First degree murder
Guillermo Masio
3I just wanted to kill him/her
David Hollywood
3 -1Multiple first degree murder/homicide
AllegroTrans
3 -1USA: premeditated felony murder / on a joint prosecution of offenses/
Adrian MM.
Summary of reference entries provided
Concurso real
Sergio Kot

Discussion entries: 3





  

Answers


12 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 4/5Answerer confidence 4/5
First degree murder


Explanation:
Habría que ver de qué tipo de concurso real se habla, para de ser necesario aclarar a situación, pero en Estados Unidos no hay nada más arriba que el First degree murder que equivale a homicidio premeditado y al que cabe siempre la pena máxima.

Example sentence(s):
  • For instance, in New York, first-degree murder requires that the murder involve “special circumstances,” such as the murder of a police officer.

    https://www.justia.com/criminal/offenses/homicide/first-degree-murder/
Guillermo Masio
Argentina
Works in field
Native speaker of: Spanish
Notes to answerer
Asker: Gracias. Ambos tienen razón. Y todavía no encuentro el modo exacto de traducirlo (si es que la ley de USA contempla tal figura...). Es first degree murder, y también refiere al tipo de condena por lo que Sergio exolicó en su hilo. Hay más de un crimen concomitante (supongo que lo más probable es que fuera un robo que derivó en homicidio.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
neutral  Sergio Kot: Creo que no se refiere a la gravedad del delito, sino al tipo de condena.
24 mins
  -> Claro. Hablo de la condena, no de la gravedad del delito. En la pregunta aclaran que los tecnicismos no son importantes, por lo cual pensé que el diálogo podía ir: "Second degree murder? // First degree murder".
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52 mins   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
Multiple first degree murder/homicide


Explanation:
Assumin translator wants US English.

AllegroTrans
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:24
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 1656
Notes to answerer
Asker: Thanks Allegro. As Guillermo says, this is not a multiple homicide. At least not that we know. "Concurso real" means that the accused has committed more than one kind of crime, for example (and highly probably in this case) robbery and homicide.


Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Guillermo Masio: I definitely don't believe this is the case of a multiple homicide.
12 hrs
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2 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5 peer agreement (net): -1
"Homicidio premeditado en concurso real" con....
USA: premeditated felony murder / on a joint prosecution of offenses/


Explanation:
en real concurso connotes to me that there is something missing, namely other 'serially connected' offens/ces he has been 'banged up for', like illegal possession of firearms in Vienna City Center, breaking and entering, smashing a window etc. in order to commit the murder. In E&W, the broken window would be left off lest to avoid 'overloading' the bill of indictment.

Sour grapes, perhaps, as in my answer on the discussion entry weblink, but concurrent offences could be prosecutable, both jointly / en concurso real/ and separately / en concurso formal o ideal > for mulitple offenses committed by a single act: West.

'USA: FELONY MURDER DOCTRINE:

The Law.com Law Dictionary & Black's Law Dictionary 2nd Ed.

Criminal law rule where a death that is caused *during the commission of a dangerous felony act*, even if accidental, may result in a charge against the defendant as first degree murder. The defendant felon can be charged with first degree murder even if the defendant didn’t actually kill the victim, e.g. an accomplice did when shooting the clerk in the bank.'

For further enlightenment as to 'felonies' / E&W: serious arrestable offences vs. misdemeanors > non-serious, non-arrestable offences, refer to 50 Cent etc. Gangsta' Rap music.

Example sentence(s):
  • US of A: N.Y. Crim. Proc. Law § 40.40 Current through 2020 NY Law Chapter 272 Section 40.40 - Separate prosecution of jointly prosecutable offenses; when barred

    Reference: http://www.proz.com/kudoz/spanish-to-english/law-general/132...
    Reference: http://dictionary.thelaw.com/premeditated-murder/
Adrian MM.
Austria
Specializes in field
Native speaker of: Native in EnglishEnglish
PRO pts in category: 574

Peer comments on this answer (and responses from the answerer)
disagree  Guillermo Masio: I'm not sure it's a felony murder. Could be, but we don't know. Too wild a shot.
10 hrs
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15 hrs   confidence: Answerer confidence 3/5Answerer confidence 3/5
I just wanted to kill him/her


Explanation:
in this context

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Note added at 15 hrs (2020-11-17 04:02:02 GMT)
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bearing in mind that this is an interview and the subject is not a legal expert

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Note added at 15 hrs (2020-11-17 04:03:37 GMT)
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from the gut

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Note added at 15 hrs (2020-11-17 04:08:36 GMT)
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no creo que haya falta buscar un término jurídico en este contexto

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Note added at 16 hrs (2020-11-17 04:44:07 GMT)
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just see what he/she says

David Hollywood
Local time: 11:24
Works in field
Native speaker of: English
PRO pts in category: 1245
Notes to answerer
Asker: Gracias David, pero no es el caso. Ni siquiera me parece que eso suene a tipificación de un crímen sino a una confesión. En cualquier caso, se trata de crímenes distintos que se unen en una condena. Asesinato y otro...robo por ejemplo.

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Reference comments


30 mins peer agreement (net): +2
Reference: Concurso real

Reference information:
Discusión: Concurso real

El concurso real supone la comisión de dos o más delitos distintos o independientes (fáctica como jurídicamente) por parte de la misma persona y que aún no han sido sentenciados (no es pluralidad de sentencias, es una sentencia respecto de varios actos) y tiene importancia a la hora de determinar la pena finalmente asignada (en consideración a todos los delitos cometidos).
Ahora bien, dependiendo del país en concreto, el tratamiento puede ser la acumulación aritmética de penas, acumulación jurídica o asperación, o el de absorción...

CONCURRENCE
Those imprisoned for multiple crimes usually serve a concurrent sentence in which the period of imprisonment equals the length of the longest sentence where the sentences are all served together at the same time, while others serve a consecutive sentence in which the period of imprisonment equals the sum of all the sentences served sequentially, or one after the other.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sentence_(law)

CONCURRENT SENTENCE
n. when a criminal defendant is convicted of two or more crimes, a judge sentences him/her to a certain period of time for each crime. Then out of compassion, leniency, plea bargaining, or the fact that the several crimes are interrelated, the judge will rule that the sentences may all be served at the same time, with the longest period controlling.

https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/concurrent se...

Example sentence(s):
  • Premeditated murder in real concurrency.

    https://www.linguee.com/spanish-english/translation/concurso+real.html
    https://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/concurrent+sentence
Sergio Kot
Israel
Works in field
Native speaker of: Native in HebrewHebrew, Native in SpanishSpanish
PRO pts in category: 47
Note to reference poster
Asker: Thank you all, I think this is the right direction. Not yet there, but still searching.

Asker: Apparently it's "premeditated murder with concurrence of offences".


Peer comments on this reference comment (and responses from the reference poster)
agree  AllegroTrans: OK but "Premeditated murder in real concurrency" makes no sense at all
19 mins
  -> Well... Neither does "assumin". And it was just a thought, not a proposed answer. Thank you.
neutral  liz askew: premeditated murder with concurrent sentence?
20 hrs
agree  Wendy Streitparth: concurrent sentence for premeditated murder?
1 day 2 hrs
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