| Vom Thema belegte Seiten: < [1 2 3] > | Poll: Have you ever been scammed in your translation career? Initiator des Themas: ProZ.com Staff
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Graeme Walle (X) 
Finnland
Local time: 11:00
Finnisch > Englisch
+ ...
| Test translations are sometimes scams | Aug 10, 2012 |
... when they are larger than 300 words, and even then the potential employer can be "testing" several translators at once to get the work done for free. I am reasonably sure that this happened to me at least one or two times, especially when I was newer to the business. I also usually avoid people with free E-mails unless they check out multiple times on Proz and other sources.
| | | | Wolfgang Vogt
Argentinien
Local time: 05:00
Englisch > Deutsch
+ ...
Yes, but only once.
By an Argentinean agency, luckily a small amount (USD 70). I was told that the end client refused to pay beause of quality issues. However, when I asked which part of my translation they could only point out other translators' mistakes and eventually agreed to pay me. As you may imagine, the payment never arrived. They first promised to pay via bank transfer, then by cheque and finally wanted me to visit their office and pick up the money (quite intimidating imo).
... See more Yes, but only once.
By an Argentinean agency, luckily a small amount (USD 70). I was told that the end client refused to pay beause of quality issues. However, when I asked which part of my translation they could only point out other translators' mistakes and eventually agreed to pay me. As you may imagine, the payment never arrived. They first promised to pay via bank transfer, then by cheque and finally wanted me to visit their office and pick up the money (quite intimidating imo).
Obviously, I gave up. But until today I am being contacted every now and then by other translators who are having trouble with this agency and I am more than happy to provide the phone number of a local "cobranzas extrajudiciales" agency.  ▲ Collapse
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But 2 dishonnest agencies, which have been dealt with by the staff at Proz. Yay!
| | | | Allison Wright (X)
Portugal
Local time: 09:00
| Yes, by a multiple personality | Aug 10, 2012 |
Plenty of names, but despite being women's names (except for the Arabic one, I think), I believe this person to be male. I received one payment (before it dawned on me that this individual was not very stable) via bank transfer from the latter, who was described as "a friend". Yeah, right.
She/he last had me hanging by a thread for two-thirds of the amount owing which was supposed to have landed in my Paypal account by a certain time on the day of communication. Since then: classic ... See more Plenty of names, but despite being women's names (except for the Arabic one, I think), I believe this person to be male. I received one payment (before it dawned on me that this individual was not very stable) via bank transfer from the latter, who was described as "a friend". Yeah, right.
She/he last had me hanging by a thread for two-thirds of the amount owing which was supposed to have landed in my Paypal account by a certain time on the day of communication. Since then: classic disappearing act.
Quite strange: I did assignments for this outsourcer over a period of about five months. Jobs came thick and fast at a time when I had just finished a large (non-ProZ) job, had only recently become a member of ProZ and business was incredibly slow. At first, I was paid on time, then a reminder did the trick, then I was paid only part of what was due to me, then, I suppose robbing Peter to pay Paul became too difficult for her/him.
I only checked the Blueboard when I began to experience problems with delayed payment.
Lessons learned:
It is better not to translate at all than to work for peanuts, no matter how desperate you feel;
Never feel desperate - value yourself and your translation ability;
Spread your eggs among many baskets;
If your "translator's note" in a Word document appears on the website of the outsourcer's client, and stays there even after you have pointed this out, the outsourcer should be ignored henceforth;
English natives always write like English natives;
Translators do not complain on the Blueboard for no reason;
If you do not starve and still have a roof over you head even after not being paid, you have survived - let go of the resentment, and move on because better things are ahead.
In the words of Forrest Gump, "That's all I have to say about that"!
Edited to remove link to a Blueboard reference and conform to site rule 8. (Oursourcers should not be discussed specifically.)
[Edited at 2012-08-10 16:41 GMT] ▲ Collapse
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| Post removed: This post was hidden by a moderator or staff member because it was not in line with site rule | Sheila Wilson
Spanien
Local time: 09:00
Mitglied (2007)
Englisch
+ ...
| I've been led a dance | Aug 10, 2012 |
But I don't think the person was really a scammer, just a time-waster. We never did get to the actual work bit! Nowadays, I can spot them much more quickly and tell them 'No thanks'!
| | | | Henry Hinds
Vereinigte Staaten
Local time: 02:00
Englisch > Spanisch
+ ...
In stillem Gedenken | Scam - Fraud | Aug 10, 2012 |
Mario Chavez wrote:
The first thing that came to mind was the traditional Nigerian scam. You know, emails purporting to offer a large sum of money in exchange for bank info. Or other emails promising money in exchange of forwarding the offending email to all your friends. I can't believe any sentient person would fall for those though.
Now, one thing is to be scammed, another thing is to be a victim of fraud (nonpayment of a billed job, for example). The risk of fraud is inherent in all business dealings; that's why due diligence is paramount.
So, I would suggest a better clarification of the term "scammed." Better yet, let's stay away from American English colloquialisms.
A scam IS fraud, they are the same thing, THEFT, a crime. Non-payment of a billed job is NOT necessarily fraud. For it to be such one would have to prove that the party owing had no intention of paying and was attempting to steal which is a crime, and in a non-payment situation that is not so easy to prove. The fact that a party fails to pay because of insolvency, poor management and a thousand other excuses is not a crime, it is merely a case for civil action to collect.
Clarification: SCAM = FRAUD.
And Mario, if you do not know those American English colloquialisms, I suggest you start learning; after all they are part of what we have to deal with in our profession. But you're right, some risk is inherent in all business dealings, but many times it cannot be classified as fraud.
| | | | Yaotl Altan
Mexiko
Local time: 02:00
Mitglied (2006)
Englisch > Spanisch
+ ...
Yes, by a big Chinese firm which still has my 8 USD for a short translation.
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| Anything that can go wroing ....... | Aug 10, 2012 |
Graeme Waller wrote:
... when they are larger than 300 words, and even then the potential employer can be "testing" several translators at once to get the work done for free. I am reasonably sure that this happened to me at least one or two times, especially when I was newer to the business. I also usually avoid people with free E-mails unless they check out multiple times on Proz and other sources.
I'm always suspicious of proposal of "test translations" to the extent of phobia.
Sometime ago I posted similar poll question asking my ProZ collegues f they think these who are asking free test translation can be fraudulent. Mojority answered, if I remember correctly, saying that "no need to worry", in other words trust them since they are OK.
But in my phobia mind this idea still floating around ---- May be they (i.e. the job posters who are asking trial translation) are chopping up some articles part to part to be translated and give trusting translators such as me do that part for free as testing. Then putting together all parts and turn in to their client for fee. Of course if this was the case their profit is 100%!
I don't care you may think I'm crazy or laugh at me. Also be reminded that I am not in a position to put my fingers on any such particular and real case. But my dear fellow translators, "Anything that can go wrong probably will" (if you are American or adept to American pragmatism, then you know this idea is called "Murphy's Law").
Yours,
[Edited at 2012-08-10 18:59 GMT]
| | | | Jean Chao
Vereinigte Staaten
Local time: 01:00
Englisch > Chinesisch
+ ...
| 100% scammed once | Aug 10, 2012 |
It was at the beginning of my full-time freelancer life on some kind of translation “directory”, I made sure that I request for a PO for this a-few-thousand-dollar worth of jobs. The agency accepted my rate without any negotiation (red flag #1) from a web-based email (red flag #2). I Googled the address on the PO issued by this “Korean” agency. I found their office located in a kind of industrial park in a remote area (red flag #3).
I turned in the first job. Obviously... See more It was at the beginning of my full-time freelancer life on some kind of translation “directory”, I made sure that I request for a PO for this a-few-thousand-dollar worth of jobs. The agency accepted my rate without any negotiation (red flag #1) from a web-based email (red flag #2). I Googled the address on the PO issued by this “Korean” agency. I found their office located in a kind of industrial park in a remote area (red flag #3).
I turned in the first job. Obviously, I demonstrated all the characteristics of a trusting, unsuspecting and good-natured human being. Immediately following the first job, this scammer from Shanghai, China (later a few of the translators who were scammed managed to piece the scammer’s profile together) sent me one more big job, which is an annual report from a big Chinese automotive company. However, after I keyed in the name of this public company in China, Google came back with nothing (red flag #4). Later as I recalled, there was this "XYZ" company in the source text of the first job they gave me too.
Out of desperation to establish myself quickly, I missed all these red flags and didn't get a penny from this scammer. Even a few of us translators tried to ban together to see if we can make collection from this scammer in China, we couldn't make it work. What I've earned from this job is always, always double, triple check before accepting jobs (especially big ones) from someone you had no previous dealing before. I’d Google the company name, go to their website and even call the company number (not only the number provided by the outsourcer) if in doubt.
For out-of-area agencies, I’d ask for a Skype talk if approached by an agency without any reference to make sure if they're really in this translation business from a "face-to-face" talk.
Being a positive thinker who always looks forward, I regard this experience as a lesson learned and price paid. Fortunately, this is the only one time I was scammed. ▲ Collapse
| | | | | All good advice!! | Aug 10, 2012 |
[quote]Allison Wright wrote:
Lessons learned:
It is better not to translate at all than to work for peanuts, no matter how desperate you feel;
Never feel desperate - value yourself and your translation ability;
Spread your eggs among many baskets;
If your "translator's note" in a Word document appears on the website of the outsourcer's client, and stays there even after you have pointed this out, the outsourcer should be ignored henceforth;
English natives always write like English natives;
Translators do not complain on the Blueboard for no reason;
If you do not starve and still have a roof over you head even after not being paid, you have survived - let go of the resentment, and move on because better things are ahead.
In the words of Forrest Gump, "That's all I have to say about that"!
I couldn't agree more.
| | | | DianeGM
Local time: 11:00
Mitglied (2006)
Niederländisch > Englisch
+ ...
| Wiser now ... | Aug 10, 2012 |
Assuming 'scammed' to mean - hired for a job which the outsourcer intended not to pay for from the outset.
This happened to me a couple of times in my first year starting out as a freelancer, doing buisness on the Internet, once I was victim to a well-known Indian non-payer (he was using a new alias) for a total of 100 USD.
Though it doesn't happen often, I do consider that I have been cheated several times in minor ways (e.g. differences in word count, not being paid... See more Assuming 'scammed' to mean - hired for a job which the outsourcer intended not to pay for from the outset.
This happened to me a couple of times in my first year starting out as a freelancer, doing buisness on the Internet, once I was victim to a well-known Indian non-payer (he was using a new alias) for a total of 100 USD.
Though it doesn't happen often, I do consider that I have been cheated several times in minor ways (e.g. differences in word count, not being paid in full for proof-reading jobs which turn out to be re-translations, with jobs with a source pdf file having Trados-style discount imposed for reps and 100% matches on target word count, etc.) Every such incident has taught me another question to ask with a new client.
However this is my first and only self-employed venture and when I started I had A LOT to learn about business and doing business on the internet and I am still learning. Older and wiser now. ▲ Collapse
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samah A. fattah
Ägypten
Local time: 11:00
Mitglied (2009)
Englisch > Arabisch
+ ...
Hello
Twice!
Silly Me!
Last one was one in May 2012, his name is : Fredric Terra
Oracan Translate ;
Just Ask me to send you his email address with full details
He ordered me a large project nearly 15000 or more
En > Ar
He never reply or pay till now
Internet is not totally safe
Good luck everyone!
Samah
[Edited at 2012-08-10 23:41 GMT]
| | | | Mario Chavez (X)
Local time: 04:00
Englisch > Spanisch
+ ...
| Stop right there | Aug 11, 2012 |
Henry Hinds wrote: Mario Chavez wrote:
The first thing that came to mind was the traditional Nigerian scam. You know, emails purporting to offer a large sum of money in exchange for bank info. Or other emails promising money in exchange of forwarding the offending email to all your friends. I can't believe any sentient person would fall for those though.
Now, one thing is to be scammed, another thing is to be a victim of fraud (nonpayment of a billed job, for example). The risk of fraud is inherent in all business dealings; that's why due diligence is paramount.
So, I would suggest a better clarification of the term "scammed." Better yet, let's stay away from American English colloquialisms. A scam IS fraud, they are the same thing, THEFT, a crime. Non-payment of a billed job is NOT necessarily fraud. For it to be such one would have to prove that the party owing had no intention of paying and was attempting to steal which is a crime, and in a non-payment situation that is not so easy to prove. The fact that a party fails to pay because of insolvency, poor management and a thousand other excuses is not a crime, it is merely a case for civil action to collect. Clarification: SCAM = FRAUD. And Mario, if you do not know those American English colloquialisms, I suggest you start learning; after all they are part of what we have to deal with in our profession. But you're right, some risk is inherent in all business dealings, but many times it cannot be classified as fraud.
Mr. Hinds, bringing condescending remarks into a discussion does not become us professionals. A modicum of mutual respect is required.
My call for a clarification was more on behalf of people not living in America (I do, thank you for asking). I know full well what a scam is, sir, but we should all strive for clarity and avoid ambiguity as much as possible.
| | | | | No, not so far | Aug 11, 2012 |
I am very careful when I take on new clients and tend to maintain long term collaborations, thus limiting my exposure to non payers and other scams.
What I find sometimes difficult is waiting for the initial payment from a new client (and hoping all goes well).
Before I accept a new client, I usually
- Exchange a few emails to evaluate their behavior and professionalism
- Check their rating on proz, if available, and accept only clients with excellen... See more I am very careful when I take on new clients and tend to maintain long term collaborations, thus limiting my exposure to non payers and other scams.
What I find sometimes difficult is waiting for the initial payment from a new client (and hoping all goes well).
Before I accept a new client, I usually
- Exchange a few emails to evaluate their behavior and professionalism
- Check their rating on proz, if available, and accept only clients with excellent ratings
- Check their Web site, to evaluate the size of the company, the kind of work they do and the manner in which they present themselves
- Look elsewhere online to evaluate their Web presence
- Agree on amount and terms of payment
- I avoid working for clients in certain countries. This is unfortunate, but has proven to be a good practice it seems.
So far, so good. I just accepted a new clients today... we'll see how it goes. ▲ Collapse
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