| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8] > | 本次翻译竞赛讨论 Thread poster: Jinhang Wang
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wherestip 
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
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Among others, two of the basic things that kids learn in school are to read and write, how are they supposed to read an encyclopedia without going to school first?
| | | | Phil Hand
China
Local time: 03:41
Chinese to English
| But if you can find the right equivalent... | Nov 27, 2012 |
wherestip wrote:
书僮磨墨，墨抹书僮一脉墨
梅香添煤，煤爆梅香两眉煤
猪八戒照镜子， 里外不是人
Translatable? Of course. But do you retain any of the wordplay or humor in the translation? Hardly.
But this is the discipline and the challenge. You read past the form to the meaning, then recreate it, using a set phrase if there is one, creating wordplay if there isn't... this is the fun bit!
Blacked by the black with which he learns
Blacked by the black that the fire burns
Knowledge flows in precious ink, my student gives it his coat to drink.
Heat from noble coal we seek, the maid applies it to her cheek.
...every tale condemns me for a villain.
sauce for neither the goose nor the gander
about as popular as a root canal
Right, spent far too much time on those. I shouldn't enjoy them so much really. I just wanted to defend the choice of contest materials - yes, in some ways they're untranslatable, but sometimes we have to deal with that. And while lbone is right that one may not be able to clearly distinguish 好 or 不好 in this kind of translation, we might still find a little enjoyment in it!
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
+ ...
| Original language | Nov 27, 2012 |
Phil Hand wrote: wherestip wrote:
书僮磨墨，墨抹书僮一脉墨
梅香添煤，煤爆梅香两眉煤
猪八戒照镜子， 里外不是人
Translatable? Of course. But do you retain any of the wordplay or humor in the translation? Hardly. But this is the discipline and the challenge. You read past the form to the meaning, then recreate it, using a set phrase if there is one, creating wordplay if there isn't... this is the fun bit! Blacked by the black with which he learns Blacked by the black that the fire burns Knowledge flows in precious ink, my student gives it his coat to drink. Heat from noble coal we seek, the maid applies it to her cheek. ...every tale condemns me for a villain. sauce for neither the goose nor the gander about as popular as a root canal Right, spent far too much time on those. I shouldn't enjoy them so much really. I just wanted to defend the choice of contest materials - yes, in some ways they're untranslatable, but sometimes we have to deal with that. And while lbone is right that one may not be able to clearly distinguish 好 or 不好 in this kind of translation, we might still find a little enjoyment in it!
Phil,
Better you than me. 
I'm definitely not criticizing the contest material picked. But I do believe some texts could only be fully appreciated in the original language. 
| | | | Jinhang Wang
China
Local time: 03:41
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER | 有些妙语、幽默只能在本土语言中欣赏 | Nov 28, 2012 |
wherestip wrote: But I do believe some texts could only be fully appreciated in the original language.
就拿这次Yogi Berra 语录来说吧，其中的以下几条在原文中欣赏更有味道：
1. "When you come to a fork in the road, take it."
关键在 fork
2. "The future ain't what it used to be."
"ain't what it used to be" 是固定用法，但是前面放上 The future 就成笑话了。
3. "A nickel ain't worth a dime anymore."
"ain't worth a dime anymore" 是固定用法，但是前面放上 A nickel 就成笑话了。
4. Mrs. Lindsay: "You certainly look cool." Yogi Berra: "Thanks, you don't look so hot yourself."
关键在 hot 与 cool
其实，我们中文中也有大量类似的语句，只能在中文中才能很好地欣赏。
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Jinhang Wang
China
Local time: 03:41
English to Chinese
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
"I'm not going to buy my kids an encyclopedia. Let them walk to school like I did."
解释：在 Proz 的英文说明中对这句话的解释有：
He plays the ignorant, on purpose, of course, making use of 'cyclopedia' as if it were a vehicle.
和
I think it's a pun, not a malapropism. In my opinion it's also important that he used "walk" and not "go" ... so on foot vs. other means of transportation you can ride on.
以及
... See more "I'm not going to buy my kids an encyclopedia. Let them walk to school like I did."
解释：在 Proz 的英文说明中对这句话的解释有：
He plays the ignorant, on purpose, of course, making use of 'cyclopedia' as if it were a vehicle.
和
I think it's a pun, not a malapropism. In my opinion it's also important that he used "walk" and not "go" ... so on foot vs. other means of transportation you can ride on.
以及
There are two meanings here, as in almost all Berra's quotes. The first implication being that Encyclopedia and Cycloped sound alike to Yogi and he could either misinterpret what an encyclopedia really is or could deliberately play on that words..
下面是关于 Cycloped 的资料：
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cycloped
根据以上材料，Yogi 的原意应该是用双关的手法制造出幽默效果。不过，翻译起来就没有那么容易了，因为这种双关很难在中文中表达出来，除非在中国也生产有“百科”或“百科全书”牌的车子。
不过，换一个角度，假如这句语录中没有用双关的话，其实也蛮有哲理的。毕竟学习是个过程，而不是买本百科全书就能一下子把所有的学问都掌握了。可以和杀鸡取卵、拔苗助长比较一下。
另外一条语录
- Mrs. Lindsay: "You certainly look cool." Yogi Berra: "Thanks, you don't look so hot yourself."
其实也是使用了双关手法，也是比较难翻译，最好还是在原文中欣赏这种幽默。 ▲ Collapse
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
+ ...
A horse-powered locomotive? How does it even relate to kids going to school?
I don't think so. Look up the word "cycloped" in the American Merriam-Webster's dictionary, and there's not even an entry for this word. Neither does it exist in the Longman's Dictionary. Do you really think ... See more A horse-powered locomotive? How does it even relate to kids going to school?
I don't think so. Look up the word "cycloped" in the American Merriam-Webster's dictionary, and there's not even an entry for this word. Neither does it exist in the Longman's Dictionary. Do you really think Yogi would even know this word?
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cycloped
http://www.ldoceonline.com/spellcheck/?q=cycloped ▲ Collapse
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
+ ...
This quote has nothing to do with the mode of transportation. The sentence fragment "walk to school like I did" only has the effect of showing Yogi's reluctance as a kid to have had to routinely attend school daily. All he meant was he had every intention of having his kids go through the same childhood ritual that he had to go through.
Nobody in Yogi's financial situation would begrudge the money to buy a bike for their kids. Besides, the typical walking distance to school is o... See more This quote has nothing to do with the mode of transportation. The sentence fragment "walk to school like I did" only has the effect of showing Yogi's reluctance as a kid to have had to routinely attend school daily. All he meant was he had every intention of having his kids go through the same childhood ritual that he had to go through.
Nobody in Yogi's financial situation would begrudge the money to buy a bike for their kids. Besides, the typical walking distance to school is only a few city blocks. There are school buses for kids who live farther away from school, just like Yueyin mentioned.
[Edited at 2012-11-29 04:17 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | QUOI
Chinese to English
+ ...
| Well, IHMO... | Nov 29, 2012 |
It's just not very funny if it's interpreted this way, and "funny" is a common element to all Yogi's one-liners.
My parents forced me to attend school every day when I was a kid so it is my turn to force my children to walk to school daily. Um...pretty mean and not funny.
But different people look at things differently...
I am sure Yogi was wealthy enough to buy a school bus too.
wherestip wrote: Nobody in Yogi's financial situation would begrudge the money to buy a bike for their kids. He's no scrooge. Besides, the typical walking distance to school is only a few city blocks. There are school buses for kids who live further away from school, just like Yueyin mentioned.
[Edited at 2012-11-29 04:39 GMT]
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wherestip
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
+ ...
quoi wrote:
I am sure Yogi was wealthy enough to buy a school bus too.
So why do you think he wouldn't buy a bike for his kids? Do you think he's a mean-spirited scrooge?
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
+ ...
quoi wrote:
It's just not very funny if it's interpreted this way, and "funny" is a common element to all Yogi's one-liners.
My parents forced me to attend school every day when I was a kid so it is my turn to force my children to walk to school daily. Um...pretty mean and not funny.
But different people look at things differently...
The funny part, IMO, is he made it sound like a child could get an education by staying at home and reading through an encyclopedia. It's plausible today if the child's sole mission in life is just to get onto a TV episode of "Jeopardy!", but not when Yogi's kids were at their school age.
[Edited at 2012-11-29 14:55 GMT]
| | | | QUOI
Chinese to English
+ ...
wherestip wrote:
So why do you think he wouldn't buy a bike for his kids? Do you think he's a mean-spirited scrooge?
Not at all.
wherestip wrote:
I'm not sure where you stand on this. Could you please clarify?
I don't look too much or too deep into Yogi's quotes. Yogi had the uncanny wit to play with words and made them sound funny together. This particular quote, like all others, is just that and nothing much else. To me, "encyclopaedia - bicycle - walk" is the link and what leads me to laughter.
Why do you think this quote is memorable? I am all ears.
[Edit] Sorry just saw your post. So I see your angle.
[Edited at 2012-11-29 05:16 GMT]
| | | | Phil Hand
China
Local time: 03:41
Chinese to English
| It's definitely about bicycles | Nov 29, 2012 |
I don't know where that "cycloped" idea came from. I don't know how to demonstrate to you that it's about bikes, it's just something you know. I've heard jokes that riff on this idea (an uneducated person not knowing what an encyclopedia is and assuming it's a bike) a million times. It's one of those things that doesn't make much sense, but everyon... See more I don't know where that "cycloped" idea came from. I don't know how to demonstrate to you that it's about bikes, it's just something you know. I've heard jokes that riff on this idea (an uneducated person not knowing what an encyclopedia is and assuming it's a bike) a million times. It's one of those things that doesn't make much sense, but everyone knows it...
http://bikewalkweek.org/PDF/BWW2009.pdf
http://freshfrieda.com/2012/06/08/casual-cruising/
Remember he's using known stereotypes. In the USA, this idea of "my kids don't need anything more than I had" has long been the subject of jokes; in the UK it's phrased differently, but the same thing exists - see Monty Python's 4 Yorkshiremen. ▲ Collapse
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QUOI
Chinese to English
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| Every cycling fanatic knows ... | Nov 29, 2012 |
Encyclopaedia is a fetish for very small bicycles.
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 14:41
Chinese to English
+ ...
Phil Hand wrote: I don't know where that "cycloped" idea came from. I don't know how to demonstrate to you that it's about bikes, it's just something you know. I've heard jokes that riff on this idea (an uneducated person not knowing what an encyclopedia is and assuming it's a bike) a million times. It's one of those things that doesn't make much sense, but everyone knows it... http://bikewalkweek.org/PDF/BWW2009.pdf http://freshfrieda.com/2012/06/08/casual-cruising/
Well, in that case, he really must have been intentionally playing with words then, which IMO is not very often. Most of his funny sayings are typically spontaneous, spoken on the spur of the moment without him even realizing they are funny.
| | | | Jinhang Wang
China
Local time: 03:41
English to Chinese
+ ...
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