Jun 22, 2018 06:59
5 yrs ago
4 viewers *
English term

Roman Catholic

English to French Other Religion
I have to translate a survey item:

Catholic (includes Roman Catholic)

Is it necessary to specify "includes Roman Catholic" for the French market? "Eglise catholique romaine" is rarely encountered in France.

Thanks for your help!

Discussion

AllegroTrans Jun 23, 2018:
Yes Daryo makes a very valid point
Daryo Jun 22, 2018:
you have a more fundamental problem ... that goes beyond simply "translating".

For which country was this category "Catholic (includes Roman Catholic)" created [sounds like a country where most "Catholics" are not Roman Catholics - which one could that be???], and for what kind of survey? And what exactly would that category include **in that country** - and the most tricky question: how much would a such defined group be relevant for doing a survey in France IOW what would be a categorisation relevant for France?

There is a huge potential for confusion between what various denominations of Christianity call themselves officially, or how they are usually called by their own members, or by other members of the public, or by churches of other denominations, all that being also different from country to country! You could fill pages on the subject ... IOW you need to establish what exactly is this category "Catholic (includes Roman Catholic)" as a whole in its "country of origin"; before doing that, discussing about "les catholiques en France" is missing the point ...

In fact, you could see it as another case of needing first to be sure of the intended meaning of the terms used in the ST.

Alain Boulé Jun 22, 2018:
Selon les documents et les époques, on trouve "église catholique", "église catholique romaine" ou "église catholique romaine latine". Tout dépend qui on veut inclure ou exclure.
AllegroTrans Jun 22, 2018:
@ Alain All correct, but there are Catholic churches with their own spiritual leaders which are in full communion with the RC church (more accurately described as the Latin church) but which cannot be described as Roman Catholic.
Alain Boulé Jun 22, 2018:
Site officiel de l'église catholique En raison des séparations intervenues au sein du christianisme on distingue l’Eglise catholique romaine dont le chef spirituel est le Pape, les Eglises orthodoxes et les Eglises issues de la Réforme.

https://eglise.catholique.fr/glossaire/eglise/
mchd Jun 22, 2018:
Platary (X) Jun 22, 2018:
Bonjour Oui sans doute, mais si le texte source le précise, sans doute est-ce parce qu'il fait référence à d'autres catholiques (non romains) qui pourraient malgré tout être concernés par cette enquête (et vivre en ce moment en France, ce qui est plus que crédible) ?

Proposed translations

+4
1 hr
Selected

De l'Eglise catholique romaine

L'Eglise catholique comprend aussi les Eglises catholiques orientales.

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Note added at 2 hrs (2018-06-22 09:54:31 GMT)
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et cette expression est tout à fait utilisée en France
Peer comment(s):

agree Alain Boulé
1 hr
Merci Alain
agree writeaway
3 hrs
Merci
neutral AllegroTrans : Incorrect see https://www.catholiceducation.org/en/culture/catholic-contri...
3 hrs
agree erwan-l : Bien entendu. Usage fréquent dans plusieurs contextes, y compris celui de ce ST pour ce que l’on en sait : "including" implique a priori la précision, en toute logique.
23 hrs
Merci Erwan
agree mchd : http://www.ciao.ch/f/croyances/infos/cac88e31eb0f001a7d2e184...
1 day 20 hrs
Merci
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Merci à tous!"
-2
28 mins

Catholique

En effet vous avez raison, l’appellation « Église catholique romaine » n’est jamais utilisée en France.
Peer comment(s):

disagree mchd : http://theopedie.com/Que-signifie-catholique-romain.html
9 mins
agree Madeleine van Zanten
18 mins
disagree Platary (X) : "jamais utilisé" est définitivement abusif et se refuse à toute autre perspective pourtant réelle...
29 mins
vous avez raison, très rarement aurait été plus approprié. Et tout dépend du contexte effectivement. En Angleterre, on spécifie systématiquement "Roman Catholic" ou RC, pour nommer ceux qu'en France on appelle communément les catholiques
disagree Daryo : we don't know what exactly is this category "Catholic (includes Roman Catholic)" in the country for which is was created, so how can you translate any of it with any certainty?
12 hrs
disagree erwan-l : Dans plusieurs contextes, évidemment souvent utilisé (théologie, dialogue inter-religieux, comparaison pays, etc.) ; tout dépend du contexte. Ici, il me semble absolument évident ("including") qu'il faut mentionner "catholique romain·e".
23 hrs
agree Laure Bayfield : "catholique" seulement si le questionnaire est diffusé en France, s'il s'agit de français à l'étranger, je préciserai "église catholique romaine"
1 day 1 hr
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-3
2 hrs

(toutes dénominations)

Might it not be simpler to replace "Roman Catholic" with a more blanket (and more natural) term such as "toutes dénominations"?
Peer comment(s):

neutral Hélène ALEXIS : ce n'est guère précis..
34 mins
disagree AllegroTrans : Definitely not, as this solution would include non-Catholic (e.g. Protestant) churches
2 hrs
disagree Daryo : absolutely no way, unless you want to unite all fractious denominations against you!!!
9 hrs
disagree mchd : les courants, peut-être, mais pas dénominations http://www.ciao.ch/f/croyances/infos/cac88e31eb0f001a7d2e184...
1 day 19 hrs
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+1
3 hrs

Catholique romaine

L'église catholique a plusieurs fragmentation
catholique romaine
catholique anglicane
etc....
Peer comment(s):

agree Mohamed Hosni : Yes, That's it.
6 hrs
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