Apr 13, 2015 08:51
9 yrs ago
21 viewers *
French term

A Mesdames et Messieurs les Présidents et Juges du Tribunal de Grande Instance

French to English Law/Patents Law (general)
What would be the best translation of this in English

Discussion

AllegroTrans Apr 13, 2015:
@ Praxis This is almost definitely from France. The TGI is the equivalent of a High Court, both in its jurisdiction and the way it is internally organised. However, unlike e.g. England, it is not a single Court and there is a separate TGI for each region of the country.
AllegroTrans Apr 13, 2015:
@ Nikki I know the asker hasn't given context, but I am 99.5% sure that this is wording at the head of a summons, defence or pleading submitted to the TGI. I often translate such documents.
praxisfrench Apr 13, 2015:
I agree that the translation can be complicated. the jurisdiction of "Grande Instance" may vary from country to country.Plus salutations also vary between countries, In India as Nikki pointed out Hon'ble is the term used for judges and generally the head of a tribunal is not called president.
Jean-Claude Gouin Apr 13, 2015:
13 WORDS ... I thought that the maximum was 10 words ...
merlrennes Apr 13, 2015:
This is complicated because I see that the Tribunal de Grande Instance can be "Regional Court", "High Court in the UK and "Supreme Court" in the US, the latter being the court of "Last resort".
In addition, in Frances juges d'instruction" are in fact prosecuting attorneys (lawyers), i.e. not judges as such. The President would be the Judge. (In the US, the Chief Justice) . The address would be "Your honours"
Nikki Scott-Despaigne Apr 13, 2015:
In order to suggest how this might be rendered, it would be helpful to have context. Is this an oral or written form of address?
(For the UK, an abbreviated form of "Honorable" would not be sufficient. I understand it is usual in India).

If this is in writing, for example, "The Honorable President and Judges of the Tribunal de Grande Instance de [Place] " might be appropriate. More context needed though. It is a specific court, a proper noun. The legal officer of that court have sepcific titles which I think should not be translated descriptively.

As for "President", it is very French. Some translators would opt for something a little more descriptive, such as "Chief Judge" or "Presiding Judge". I think there are a number of good arguments for retaining something close to the French forumlation. "President" would be unambiguous in context and is sufficiently international to be understood widely. Also, it is after all the title of the person in question.
Gaurav Sharma Apr 13, 2015:
Just tried Hon'ble Chief justice (Judge) and Judges of the Court of First Instance
Nikki Scott-Despaigne Apr 13, 2015:
Court of first instance is descriptive and not really a translation. However, I don't think you should translate the title of the court, which is a proper noun after all. Keep it in French, in italics (the convention when a text contains a foreign word) and consider a footnote, or brackets for the descriptive form.

Proposed translations

+3
4 hrs
Selected

To the Honourable Presidents and Justices of the Tribunal de Grande Instance (Regional High Court)

This is the formulation I use
I see no need to repeat the 2 different genders as it is surely implied

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Note added at 9 hrs (2015-04-13 18:12:31 GMT)
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Each division of the TGI has a President
"Presiding Judge" would also be correct for this person

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Note added at 14 hrs (2015-04-13 22:55:37 GMT)
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"Honourable" is rather optional.....
Peer comment(s):

agree Jennifer White : agree re genders, and with your rendering.
1 hr
thanks
agree Yolanda Broad
2 hrs
thanks
agree philgoddard
2 hrs
thanks
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4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Selected automatically based on peer agreement."
-1
9 mins

Hon'ble presidents and judges of the Court of first instance/Regional Court

A "Tribunal de Grande Instance" is normally the court of the first appeal.Might also be translated as regional/district court.
Peer comment(s):

disagree Nikki Scott-Despaigne : Sorry, but your suggestion and your explanation are muddled and could mislead. A French "Tribunal de Grande Instance" is a court of first instance. However a court of first instance is by its very nature not a court of appeal.
34 mins
when I say court of first appeal I mean a court where a plaintiff takes his case at the first instance. I did not mean to talk in terms of the appellate jurisdiction of a court. Besides I do not see any other viable translation for this term.
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3 hrs

To the TGI (To the Presidents and Mr. & Mrs. Justices of the High Court)

The Bench is not addressed this way on the Brit. Isles - namely the UK or Eire/Republic of Ireland.

But the initials of the court are added top right e.g. QBD = Queen's Bench Division ChD = Chancery Division of the High Court.

Otherwise, to .

TGI is *not* a court of first but second instance, namely Tribunal d'instance is first instance or county court.

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Note added at 3 hrs (2015-04-13 12:21:16 GMT)
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otherwise to: the President and Lord & Lady Justices of the TGI/High Court
Peer comment(s):

neutral AllegroTrans : Mr. and Mrs. Justices?? you mean Messrs. and Mesdames Justices?
58 mins
No. I mean simply an abbreviation in the top-right hand corner, as in the UK.
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Reference comments

1 hr
Reference:

Will this help?

Please have a look at the links below.
Peer comments on this reference comment:

neutral Daryo : useful to know, but to which extent is it a good idea to give English titles to French judges?
12 mins
neutral writeaway : with Daryo
15 mins
neutral AllegroTrans : "Right Honourable" would sound overly-British and rather unsuitable for a French Judge
12 hrs
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