Oct 4, 2011 01:06
12 yrs ago
1 viewer *
French term

faute

French to English Social Sciences Psychology Mediation & conciliation
"L’erreur n’est pas une **faute,** mais seulement un mot pour désigner que l’on n’obtient pas l’effet souhaité."

From a training presentation on mediation. (Canadian French to Canadian EN). So far, I am leading toward "An error is not a fault, but only a term to indicate that you cannot obtain the desired effect."

But I am not sure that the word "fault" conveys the idea of agency [i.e., capacity to act]. Also, am I missing a nuance of the FR word faute?

googling the phrase provides URLs such as

http://www.lalibre.be/debats/opinions/article/67002/faire-un...

http://books.google.ca/books?id=1y2fbBi7UdIC&pg=PA5&lpg=PA5&...

But skimming through these sites doesn't provide me w/ sufficient confidence -- that is why I am asking ProZ.
Change log

Oct 4, 2011 06:56: Tony M changed "Term asked" from "faute (this context)" to "faute"

Discussion

Nikki Scott-Despaigne Oct 5, 2011:
French expression Sticking my neck out, I think it is easy to fall into a trap on this one. There is absolutely no reason to deviate from an ordinary rendering of the original "erreur" and "faute". The English words "error" and "fault" are accurate representations of the ideas expressed in the French.
The problem here is to avoid "over-translating". We all wish to avoid the false friend trap. However, there is another trap : seeking to repair something which is not broken. If it ain't broken, don't fix it. If ordinary words will do, use ordinary words, even if they seem too ordinary to be true.
As the French put it, rather tongue in cheek :
Pourquoi faire simple quand on peut faire compliqué?
Nikki Scott-Despaigne Oct 4, 2011:
Might I suggest adopting a different approach and leave well enough alone with the words "error" and "fault" which I think are faithful conveyors of the author's intention? Might I suggest, however, that substituting "be" may be a good ploy?

Sugegstion :

"Error" does not mean "fault"...
"Error" does not imply "fault"...
"Error" does not suggest "fault"...

etc
Kevin SC Oct 4, 2011:
Would "gross negligence" get us anywhere ?
B D Finch Oct 4, 2011:
Context I think that further information is required on what this is all about.
Cleartrans Oct 4, 2011:
I read it as "something for which one is to blame", implying a personal shortcoming or fault. Blaming people, oneself included, is seen as counterproductive.
liz askew Oct 4, 2011:
"faute" can also = carelessness, negligence
Tony M Oct 4, 2011:
on n'obtient pas Regarding the rest of your draught translation, I'd like to suggest that 'do not obtain' might be more accurate than 'cannot obtain' — and possibly even 'fail to obtain'.

Consider the meaning of 'faute' in the term 'faute professionnelle', which may sometimes be translated as 'professional misconduct' (though in other contexts, that might not be suitable).

Proposed translations

+1
19 hrs
Selected

fault

Might I suggest adopting a different approach and leave well enough alone with the words "error" and "fault" which I think are faithful conveyors of the author's intention? Might I suggest, however, that substituting "be" may be a good ploy?

Sugegstion :

"Error" does not mean "fault"...
"Error" does not imply "fault"...
"Error" does not suggest "fault"..
Peer comment(s):

agree Tony M : I rather think you're right, and using synonyms will only actualy complicate matters and cloud the basic concept.
45 mins
I think that we tend sometimes to want to translate and complicate things which do not need to be touched at all! Translating is a great job for creating complications which are not there, for asking questions that we do not need to ask ourselves!
neutral Kevin SC : errors are rarely deliberate whereas faults often are delberate and deserve to be termed wrongdoing
13 hrs
That's a matter of interpretation! Why look complicate a very simple original which can be represented accurately by very simple English? French and English versions will then withstand semantic analysis on identical terms!
Something went wrong...
2 KudoZ points awarded for this answer. Comment: "Thank-you for your thoughtful discussion comments, they reassured me in my translation."
4 hrs

omission [or: failure] to act

Am not sure I understand the context right, so am suggesting an answer based on your comment about the target word conveying "the idea of agency [i.e., capacity to act]"

--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 4 hrs (2011-10-04 05:13:17 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------

Alternatively:
'perform' may be used instead of 'act'.
Peer comment(s):

neutral Tony M : But that would only be one particular, quite narrow type of 'faute'; it could equally well be a willful act.
1 hr
Thanks, Tony. Like I said, "Am not sure I understand the context right".
Something went wrong...
5 hrs

mistake

maybe this conveys the idea of agency better...
Peer comment(s):

neutral Tony M : I think that would be better for 'erreur'; it's all about the "to errr is human..." thing
20 mins
Something went wrong...
5 hrs

weakness

Might be barking up the wrong tree, just a suggestion...
http://www.evancarmichael.com/Business-Coach/2688/The-People...
Peer comment(s):

neutral Tony M : I was thinking along the same lines, but again, this seems to me like only a subset of all possible 'fautes'; likewise 'shortcoming' (i.e. something you could be blamed for)
21 mins
Something went wrong...
13 hrs

fault

I think you got it right the first time round.

I would argue that a fault or "faute", is an error that you make willingly and knowingly, whereas an error is, well, just a more or less innocent mistake.
Something went wrong...
-1
16 hrs

flaw or blunder

suggestion
Peer comment(s):

disagree Tony M : I'm afraid I don't think either of those would work at all naturally in EN; 'flaw' is definitely out, that would better translate 'défaut'; and 'blunder' is more like some kind of accidental 'error' than the 'faute' we have here
6 mins
Something went wrong...
Term search
  • All of ProZ.com
  • Term search
  • Jobs
  • Forums
  • Multiple search